User talk:Sapphire/Archive 2005

Hello Sapphire!

Welcome to Wikivoyage. Please take a sec to look at our copyleft and policies and guidelines, but feel free to plunge forward and edit some pages. Scanning the Manual of style, especially the article templates, can give you a good idea of how we like articles formatted. If you need help, check out Project:Help, and if you need some info not on there, post a message in the travellers' pub.

Thank you for contributing to Cincinnati and Munich.

However, I have to ask the question: Is the Cincinnati article better after you edited it than before? I notice you have done a major rewrite of the article but, to me, it seems the poorer for it. Please read our policies, guidelines and templates and the rest of the manual of style before you change too much more; otherwise you might find all your hard work being undone by some (other) merciless editor who follows the guidelines too rigidly. I do like the google local map thingy though - interesting. -- (WT-en) Huttite 21:53, 19 Mar 2005 (EST)

I figured out what happened. The page got deleted on your first edit and you appear to have reconstructed it from scratch. If my comment above seems harsh, please accept my apologies. If you have a problem, or anything that bugs you, please ask a question on the relevant talk page. -- (WT-en) Huttite 19:49, 25 Mar 2005 (EST)

I think that was the night I began working on that and I was using the trial-and-error method. I think the article is somewhat improved - corrections to false info, and additions.

Fortunately the trial-and-error method works well on Wikivoyage. If you make a mistake then you, or anyone else, can go back into the page history and work out what was changed and even resurrect the original text. Mind you, if all else fails you can always read the manual or even (re)write it! -- (WT-en) Huttite 05:35, 16 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Cincinnati

Thanks for all the effort you are putting into Cincinnati. I notice you removed the {{stub}} message. Unfortunately the Cope and Get out sections do not have any content yet, so, technically, the article is still a stub article. As you seem to know a lot about the city, if you can put something into the Cope and Get out sections then that would polish the article off nicely - at least as a small city.

The Cope section is for tips for surviving in town, like the public laundry, hairdressers, and all those myriad of services one cannot do without.

The Get out section is for ideas for travelling on, such as the next destinations in a roadtrip or daytrips, etc.

There are also some other missing template sections, like Buy, Learn and Work, so there is plenty more that it is possible to contribute. -- (WT-en) Huttite 19:44, 25 Mar 2005 (EST)

I added to the Cope section and the Get out section. I also added a "Learn" section. I didn't add a work section, because I wouldn't know where to begin. Most people I know who move to Cincinnati just start working at restaurants and then go from there. The google thing wasn't my idea. I have no idea who added that. - (WT-en) Sapphire

Good work

Cincinnati's looking really good now! Welldone ^_^ -- (WT-en) Lionfish 23:25, 05 Mar 2005 (BST)

Thank you! (WT-en) Sapphire

Who needs qualifications?

I disagree with the claim on (WT-en) your user page that you feel you must be about the only person without a degree or professional qualification to edit articles on Wikivoyage. What good is a qualification here anyway? They do not give courses in writing for Wikivoyage as far as I know. And, as one professor warned me, a qualification only proves you can pass exams and might also show you can think! You do not need a qualification to edit Wikivoyage, just an Internet connection that allows you access to edit. I see many contributions to Wikivoyage and some make me wonder if the contributor even had a proper education, let alone a degree. Unfortunately, most of those contributors are anonymous and I never know their names or educational background. However, their raw gems of contributions are lovingly polished (or beaten) into shape by other contributors. What you finally see is the collective work of many people. A few of us are even brave enough to identify ourselves by having a user page. Perhaps having a qualification also gives some people the courage to start a user page. While it appears a lot of people here have a degree or qualification, that fact does not mean you need one to contribute here. You may know things that nobody else thinks important (because it would be here otherwise). Keep up the good work because making good contributions is all you need to contribute successfully to Wikivoyage. -- (WT-en) Huttite 05:35, 16 Apr 2005 (EDT)

I would disagree with that too, but, fortunately I don't, because that not what I meant. I just noticed a lot (that has now changed as I've realized the full scale of WikiTravel) users are in computer related fields. I'm currently in the field of gathering money to go on an eagerly anticipated North American train journey. I noticed that you (and I'll quote you, because I like the way you worded it) "For a living, I persuade computers and other electonic systems to explain what humans have been doing with them so I can explain that to other humans." I wish I could persuade this computer to do the things I wanted it to do, unfortunately, some family members believe in the "violence and technology DO mix" fix it method.

Anyhow, I agree with you. Its part of the reason I like WikiTravel. I dislike how some companies and organizations require you to have a degree to obtain a position with them. I.e. Travel companies that sometimes require you to have a journalism degree. Maybe it would help, but there are pleanty of people I think who are well traveled and have an amazing grasp of the English language. For example a guy name Jawad - (his website) www.smilingterrorist.com, hopefully he's worked out the kinks that is friend added to his site.

BTW, is there an easier way to make the "|" character without copying and pasting?

-Thanks, -(WT-en) Sapphire 18:33, 16 Apr 2005 (EDT)

As I quoted above Qualifications prove ... you can think. Employers want someone they know they can trust to do a good job. Many think a qualification demonstrates this without appreciating it only proves the student was only able to pass the exam(s) that they sat on the day they sat them. I do not have a degree in computer science, but one in electrical engineering. Although I can read the circuit diagram of a computer, and probably construct one from its component parts; all my ability in persuading computers to do things has been learned on the job and through reading the manual or help file - out of need and necessity. My current and several previous jobs have required knowledge of Law, Accountancy, Politics, Mathematics and Computer Science as much as Engineering, although I only studied the last two subjects generally in my Engineering degree course, the rest of my knowledge has been gained though experience. A few years ago I was told I did not have the commercial experience for a job as an engineer and now wonder if I should be taking a degree in accounting or law (to support my experience) so I can be an engineer! I suspect that I would then be considered overqualified and still not get the job! In my experience, qualifications are often a way for personnell recruiters to eliminate the apparently (un)qualified from the shortlist for a job interview. Once you get a job, how relevant are the qualifications - really? Fortunately Wikivoyage is voluntary and you do not need to an interview to contribute - your qualifications are not relevant - your contributions are.

Concerning the application of violence to technology - yes they DO mix but the person gains only a psychological benefit, though possibly at a physical cost due to the damage caused by the application of (reasonable?) force to the technology. Complaints of the resulting damage (physical and psychological) should really be directed to the engineers who originally designed or developed the technology in the first place as it is obviously not fit for its purpose - unless their intention was for the technology to cause frustration and thereby make it the subject of violence in order to release frustration. Perhaps this is why Bill Gates appears to be one of the most reviled men in the world and you cannot throw a computer a hundred meters with a snow plough (Like HP once claimed for one of their calculators.) and expect it to continue operating.

BTW the "|" character on my keyboard is Shift-"\" and is located between the backspace and enter keys just to the right of the "}" or "]" key.

- (WT-en) Huttite 19:47, 16 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Persuading your computer to do the things you want it to do

Hi Sapphire, just so you know there is a way to get your computer to do what you want it to do. Just download a Knoppix CD image and make a CD. Then put it in your computer and reboot, et voila: the computer will work better than ever before. The CD doesn't install anything, so when you take the CD back out the computer will be just the way your other family members are used to. -- (WT-en) Mark 01:06, 17 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Books

On my Talk page, you asked ... is there an appropriate place in the guide to suggest books pertaining to a destination. Maybe a "Read" section? Thanks. (WT-en) Sapphire 00:37, 19 May 2005 (EDT)

My reply

Have a look at Project:Where you can stick it. Newspapers go in the Understand section, so perhaps appropriate books might too. But also look at Project:External links and Project:Contributor research links first. If you are suggesting a particular book for a particular location then there should be a good reason to recommend it - otherwise someone will remove it. BUT perhaps the best place is to first propose and discuss including a book on the article Talk page. -- (WT-en) Huttite 06:57, 19 May 2005 (EDT)

I know there was a reason I asked that - a really great book I came across. Ah ha! I remember Glacier National Park. Thanks

How to link from one section to another

You asked: Huttite,

Can you tell me how to make a link that takes a reader to a different part of the same article?

Thanks. (WT-en) Sapphire 22:15, 9 Dec 2005 (EST)

Add [[#Section|refered part]] as the link - this displays as refered part.

For example [[#How to link from one section to another|this section]] - this section.

See Project:Article_naming_conventions#Non-alphabetic_characters where there is a brief comment. - (WT-en) Huttite 01:17, 11 Dec 2005 (EST)