Wikivoyage:Votes for undeletion

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Welcome to Votes for undeletion


It may occur from time to time that we delete an page by mistake — that is, that the page doesn't actually meet the standards for deleting articles listed on the VFD page. In this case, a Wikivoyager should link to the page on this page, with an explanation of why the deletion wasn't in accordance with our deletion policy. Articles and images are still considered guilty until proven innocent. After fourteen (14) days of discussion, if a nomination is uncontested or a consensus arises that the page was deleted unnecessarily, then an administrator should reinstate the page. Otherwise, the page will stay deleted. Please list new pages below.

Dilli[edit]

I created this redirect more than a year ago and Ikan Kekek deleted this page as it can be a misspelling of Dili. Therefore, I would like to restore this redirect so that I can convert it into a disambiguation page. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 11:46, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Which articles need disambiguating? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 11:53, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delhi, a city in India and Dili, a city in Timor-Leste. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 11:55, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, seems reasonable. Support.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:00, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • (edit conflict) Speedily undelete with a redirect to Delhi. Redirects don't simply get speedily deleted because they may appear to be confusing (remember that redirects are cheap), and misspellings can be handled in hatnotes. In this specific case, I've rarely seen Timor-Leste's capital misspelled because the "l" is not stressed, so either way, it should redirect to Delhi with a hatnote for Dili. As for why this should be speedily undeleted, it was never formally deleted (and "misleading/confusing redirects" is not in the CSD), nor were anyone else's opinions solicited. --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 11:58, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
In a previous wikilife, Sbb1413 had a tendency to create excessive numbers of redirects. Very pleased to note this is no longer an issue, but I think the deletion rationale was sound, see Talk:Dilli. I'll let someone who knows better comment on how likely Dili is to be misspelt "Dilli".--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:21, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'd like to read an explanation of why this disambiguation is needed. Sbb1413? Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:39, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You had already said back in March 2022, "I feel like this is more likely to be a misspelling of Dili. Is this page really essential? [Sbb1413], please comment." This is why I nowadays prefer disambiguation over redirect. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 05:06, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That doesn't explain why it's necessary. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:27, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Dilli is apparently a local spelling for Delhi, so if Dilli is also a likely misspelling of Dili, then we have a search term that refers to two possible articles.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 06:03, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
OK, go ahead and undelete if you like. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:48, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Those who don't find Dilli will either correct the spelling to Dili or search for Delhi instead, wouldn't they? Is it common not to know those names? –LPfi (talk) 07:35, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This doesn't seem to have ever been resolved, but a consensus was developing for a disambiguation for Dilli. Should we resume discussion? Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:55, 5 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Reviving my remarks from February... Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:53, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Category:East Central Florida[edit]

It was deleted by Mx. Granger without reason. The East Central Florida article exists so there's no need to delete it's corresponding category. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 13:56, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

See also: Wikivoyage:Travellers' pub#Crazy tree symbol. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 13:58, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I deleted the category because at the time, the article was an extra-hierarchical region. Earlier this year, an IP user converted it back to a regular region. If the article stays part of our breadcrumb hierarchy, then of course the category should be recreated, but Florida's regionalization needs to be revisited because it's currently inconsistent. East Central Florida is breadcrumbed to Central Florida, which is breadcrumbed to Florida, but Florida#Regions doesn't list "Central Florida" because it uses a different division that separates inland areas from the coast. Pinging User:SelfieCity, who seems to have edited East Central Florida extensively. —Granger (talk · contribs) 14:58, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Wikivoyage's traditional divisions of the Florida region were purely geographical: North Florida, Central Florida, and South Florida. Breadcrumbed within Central Florida were two regions: East Central Florida and (you guessed it) West Central Florida. This isn't a bad way to subdivide Florida, but it comes with some significant flaws, particularly regarding Orlando, by far the most important city in Central Florida from a tourist's perspective (not Tampa, thanks to Disney World). The original East/West regional split necessitated Orlando's categorization within a system that did not fit it, as Orlando does not identify with either the Eastern or Western halves of the state, being in the middle of the state.
Hence, I proposed a more nuanced region structure for Florida based upon the main attractions in the state: Daytona Speedway, the beaches, Cape Canaveral, Walt Disney World, St. Augustine, the Gulf Coast, etc. Tourists frequently travel between these places — for instance, a visitor to Central Florida may visit the beaches, Cape Canaveral, and Disney World in one trip — but they pass through non-tourist regions to go between those places. Hence, creating a category and region hierarchy with "East Central Florida" didn't make sense because it lumped together towns like Daytona Beach (a major tourist hub) and Deltona (a larger suburb of Orlando with virtually no tourist appeal).
East Central Florida is and should remain, IMHO, an extraregion. It's a cohesive region on the map, and we should have an article for it, but from a tourist's perspective in a state with an economy dependent upon tourism, it should not be how Wikivoyage by default presents a travel guide to Florida.
One thing I should point out here is that Florida is changing fast. Orlando wasn't historically a large and sprawling city, and towns like Sanford (Florida) and Kissimmee were seen as cities in their own right until the 21st century. Until the last ten years, categorizing these "towns in their own right" with small coastal towns seemed far more logical than it does now, as all the former have been amalgamated into Greater Orlando while forests and swamps still separate Orlando from the coastal towns. While some of these forests have been turned into agricultural regions, many of them are impenetrable swamp and are even labeled as lakes on some older maps. Tiger Bay, a seasonal swamp between Port Orange and DeLand, is an example of this. Obviously, there is no tourism to these places, so they form natural barriers between the Inland, which is largely urban or agricultural depending upon the specific region, and the coast, which has been urbanized along a few-mile-wide strip following the Intracoastal Waterway and the Atlantic Coast.
Hence there are two parallel region structures: the current and "real" one, which divides between coastal and Inland Florida (among other regions), and the previous "ghost" structure of Central Florida divided into West and East. East Central Florida should be breadcrumbed to Central Florida, as it is part of Central Florida, and West Central Florida should be breadcrumbed to Central Florida. But within that system, they are still extraregions.
If there's opposition to categorizing extraregions within extraregions, we could merge East and West Central Florida into one Central Florida article.
I should clarify one point: I have lived in Florida for several years and never heard "East Central Florida" or "West Central Florida" used in conversation, but I hear "Central Florida" almost every day. That said, the identity of "Central Florida" has grown to be associated with the University of Central Florida, a university in the suburbs of Orlando and the second largest public university in the United States.
Sorry for writing an essay but there's lot of nuance because Florida has no clear geographical boundaries: few rivers and no mountain ranges to clearly divide it into regions. Hopefully this clarifies the current system somewhat and proposes a possible change (article merge) that could simplify the extraregion hierarchy. --Comment by Selfie City (talk) (contributions) 16:48, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@SelfieCity: Thanks for this explanation. If East Central Florida and West Central Florida are not locally recognized regions and are not part of the breadcrumb hierarchy, then I don't see much point in keeping them as articles. Is there any good reason not to merge? —Granger (talk · contribs) 21:27, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
No, I would support merging them into Central Florida. --Comment by Selfie City (talk) (contributions) 21:45, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

User talk:Asretired[edit]

User talk pages are not supposed to be deleted (they can be blanked, however) as it deletes the history behind it, and this one was deleted out of line with Wikivoyage's policy. It should be a speedy undeletion, but I am not doing it myself. 1 month is more than enough for a "cool-down period". --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 07:41, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't know the policy here and had to look it up. Here is what it says:
Unlike Wikipedia, we generally do not delete talk pages, even for articles that have been deleted. There is no harm in keeping them, and occasionally they preserve something useful that someone said.
So it is possible to delete talk pages, but I think there should be a good reason to deviate from the policy, beyond the contributor retiring in a huff. It should be undeleted. If Asretired wants to come back and make a case for making an exception, they are free to do so. Ground Zero (talk) 23:31, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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