Wikivoyage talk:UX Expedition

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Annoyances of editing on an Android[edit]

I don't know how much I'll be able to assist with this expedition, because I lack technical knowhow. That said, I thought it would be relevant to mention some of the annoyances I've been experiencing while editing on my Android while in transit.

(1) I haven't found a 1-click method for accessing recent changes. Instead, I search for WV:recent, click the Wikivoyage:Recent changes patrol link, then click the link to "recent changes" in the first paragraph.

(2) More seriously, when I click a recent change, I see no way to reliably access the latest version of the article I'm looking at. It usually is in fact the latest version, but my browser gives me a big warning that it's an old version. And when I try to edit it, it's not so easy. At least today, I've been getting into the "source" and not edit mode, so that I had to go back to the list of all recent changes, click on the name of the article, and then click edit in order to actually edit the text.

Thank goodness I usually edit from my laptop! I'll post more examples of Android editing annoyances when they come up. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:35, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

And now I can't easily edit a typo??? Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:36, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
The edit or edit section buttons aren't appearing. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:38, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
I was just able to successfully click the "Latest revision" button in an article which had later revisions than the one I clicked from Recent Changes Patrol. I think the bug for Android may be that if we are indeed looking at the latest revision when we click a difference from Recent Changes Patrol, it tells us it's an old version, does nothing when we click "Latest revision", and also sometimes won't let us edit the page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:25, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
Adding listing is a pain on mobile. I ended up creating bullet list on mobile and fill in the remaining items in a separate edit later on on computer. OhanaUnitedTalk page 03:21, 6 March 2019 (UTC)

Request for changes to the marker template editor in visual edit mode[edit]

If you create a marker using the visual edit mode, there are four boxes: Type, Name, Latitude, Longitude. Shouldn't Wikidata ID also be included as one of the four main boxes? Also, if you add a Wikidata ID and then exit the editor mode, it acts as though you are lacking latitude and longitude. These issues should be corrected to encourage people to add Wikidata ID's. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 17:15, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

Put simply, "Wikidata" is labeled an optional parameter, but I think it should not be. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 17:28, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
@ARR8: Thanks for sorting this out! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 23:59, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

Templates on mobile web[edit]

In case anyone missed it, people here might be interested in this update in the pub: Wikivoyage:Travellers' pub#An update on templates on mobile web. —Granger (talk · contribs) 02:17, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

Feature Banner: Desktop and Mobile versions[edit]

  • Issue: Desktop and Mobile versions
    • Work in progress. Nearly complete, but some testing is needed. How does Main Page/Sandbox currently look on other phones? Are there any issues preventing changes in {{Banner/sandbox}} (CSS changes) from being made live? Not a rhetorical question; feedback wanted.
      • @Traveler100, SelfieCity: and anyone else wanting to help out: It works fine for me but my design decisions for the mobile appearance were subjective. Thoughts? ARR8 (talk | contribs)
        • Great that the discover and sister areas display. For feature banner though works in landscape mode but not portrait (the way most people view) on a medium sized mobile. I am not sure having the text in the image is the way to go with mobile, if you make the view area narrow, apart from not having enough space for all the text is covers the whole image, cannot see the picture and text reading is difficult. Is it possible to have different rules for desktop and mobile apart from the problematic current method? --Traveler100 (talk) 21:24, 19 February 2019 (UTC)
          @Traveler100: Strange, it works in portrait mode on my phone. What are you seeing? Could you upload a screenshot? ARR8 (talk | contribs) 21:37, 19 February 2019 (UTC)
          @ARR8: see File:Screenshot 20190219-224012 Chrome.jpg. On Galaxy S7 edge using Chrome --Traveler100 (talk) 21:46, 19 February 2019 (UTC)
          @Traveler100: I've taken a new approach. What do you (and anybody else reading) think about Main Page/sandbox2? All details can be tweaked, but the general idea is there. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 03:38, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          @ARR8: That is clever and an interesting idea. I think positive that the pictures are first visible. Text can be called is cool and makes the page interactive. Is there a way to dismiss the text once selected to get back to the pictures?--Traveler100 (talk) 06:47, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          Would it be possible to have text drop down below the image push what is below that further down?--Traveler100 (talk) 10:19, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          @Traveler100: Currently, you can dismiss the text by tapping one of the other pictures, or any blank space elsewhere on the page. Text below the image is fine, but pushing everything else down may be a problem; I'll look into it. I'd rather not do one without the other, as it may cover the other banners. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 12:25, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          Maybe also keep the title on the image, if you can do that and at the same time the touch icon. --Traveler100 (talk) 12:42, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          @Traveler100: For various reasons, it is not simple to push everything else down when the text appears. Let's assume it's not possible for now and look for other solutions. I've added a rule for relative vertical positioning of the text on the image, and I've instead pushed it up. I'm comfortable doing that, because I assume most people who tap the images will do so top-to-bottom. I've put it at 50% up, so half the image is still visible, but it can be set to anything. What do you think about this solution?
          It is possible to get the title to show up, but I honestly prefer it without, as it shows more of the image and you get more of a "tap to reveal" effect. I can do a proof-of-concept if you'd like, though. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 16:35, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          the position of the tap text is better higher up.--Traveler100 (talk) 18:26, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          Have you got a percent in mind? Currently 50%, and at 100%, the box won't overlap the image at all. Values >100% are also possible. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 20:12, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          @Traveler100: And, of course, please feel free to make changes/tweaks like this yourself. The line which controls this is indicated by a comment in the CSS file, near the bottom. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 20:29, 20 February 2019 (UTC)
          I think the current position of a little above is good. Would be useful to get others feedback though. But as this solves the problem of the other sections being visible I would say if no feedback soon, make this live. --Traveler100 (talk) 08:49, 22 February 2019 (UTC)

    • @ARR8: Has not worked. Appears to the problem that works when code is on another page but not when the actual main page. --Traveler100 (talk) 20:39, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
      @Traveler100: Yes, seems to be the same as the other templates. When we finish Mapbanner, we can file a Phabricator ticket to use the supported main page functionality, and I'm hopeful that, when we do this, all the templates will appear. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 21:49, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
      Suggest the change is undone untill issue solved as currently cannot see feature pages on mobile, previous method was not perfect but at least worked. --Traveler100 (talk) 21:57, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
      I would ask to hold off on that. I'm hoping we can finish the redesign relatively soon, and we'll have to deal with hidden templates while our ticket is in the queue, anyway. ARR8 (talk | contribs)22:00, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
      Agreed — while I absolutely support the redesign, I think we should be careful about keeping the redesign going on the basis that an issue will be solved at some point in the future. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 22:42, 22 February 2019 (UTC)

Flags for "issue" bullet points[edit]

Just wanted to say, I like those! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 15:31, 23 February 2019 (UTC)

Table in Communication[edit]

The sections of it are not aligned as they should be on my screen. There's a little bit of table here, a little bit there, etc. If this is the case on most screens, it should be fixed. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 20:01, 2 March 2019 (UTC)

Responsive design[edit]

Swept in from the pub

Just wanted to say to the community: it's been great to see all the work that has been put into responsive web design lately! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 18:43, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for noticing! And to everyone: please, if you have any problems or design suggestions, let us know! ARR8 (talk | contribs) 18:48, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
Have you thought about creating a responsive design expedition? --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 19:09, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
At the German Wikivoyage there is such an expedition. Such an expedition seems to be necessary because of multitude of problems not only for smartphones. --RolandUnger (talk) 19:50, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
True. If there's anyone who wants to start it, I'd be willing to help and join the expedition. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 20:54, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
I'm not sure. It may be nice to have a centralized place to discuss these things, rather than the mess of talk pages we've been using, but there may not be too many templates left to modify. I'll go along with User:Traveler100 on this, since it was he who started this whole endeavor. ARR8 (talk | contribs) 21:13, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
I know I'm not T100, but may I add: maybe we could create a talk page for the issue, or even a Wikivoyage space page, that is not an expedition. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 21:31, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
Maybe not an Expedition just for Responsive but a general one for User Experience. Would include working on pages so they are good on all browsers, but also how listing editor works, how the main page looks and format of pages in general. --Traveler100 (talk) 07:46, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
Sounds like a good idea. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 14:48, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
Written a few ideas down at Wikivoyage:UX_Expedition. All please expand and correct as you feel fit. And, a little ironically, think of a better layout for the page. --Traveler100 (talk) 18:00, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
Thanks for all the effort you have put into the expedition! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 01:11, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

Can’t block users on iPhone[edit]

Swept in from the pub

This is serious. I haven’t been able to turn my laptop on since last night, and when I look at user contributions on my phone, I’m given no option to change their status or block them. I also was unable to delete a redirect, because no matter what I did, it continued redirecting. If we are serious about wanting people to edit and moderate this site now and in the years to come, we’ve got to make the interface with cellphones stop sucking. I’m using Safari on an iPhone6S. I’m thoroughly disgusted and frustrated, and I’m outta here for the night. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:54, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

Ikan - I agree with you about our mobile interface. A workaround to use until it's improved is to scroll down to the bottom of any Wikivoyage page on mobile and click on "Desktop view". The text ends up quite a bit smaller (this is why I periodically have trouble with accidental rollbacks!) but it gives you all the functionality you'd otherwise have on your laptop. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:15, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
Thanks for the suggestion. By the way, if anyone is wondering what happened to my android, it worked fine until, after just 2 years and a few months, it suddenly went completely dead. On that basis, I can’t recommend the Moto G5. Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:19, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
  • Should we perhaps make a request to the WMF about this? --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 16:35, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
    When I was invited to complete the Global Wikimedia Survey last year, the shite mobile interface was one of the issues I raised. Nothing was mentioned in the linked report, yet since then, there have been some improvements, but it's slow going. Since I know nothing about the amount of work such improvements actually require, I won't pass judgement on whether they're moving too slowly, but the system is overdue an upgrade.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 16:55, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
    On the general question of editing from a mobile device, the Editing team is working on the mobile visual editor, and I'd love to have a few of you try out this prototype: It's a (fake) wiki, and you need to be in the mobile mode, and then in the visual editing mode. It should default correctly, but if it doesn't, you can switch it (same as here). Ping me with questions, or you know that volunteer-me drops by here most days anyway. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:32, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

Ikan, when you say "it continued redirecting", were you getting redirected back to the mobile site (which unfortunately wasn't designed for admin work)? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 19:48, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

No. I’m talking about a redirect from “Terra” to Destinations. I wasn’t able to delete the redirect because I couldn’t land on it. In desktop mode, when you’re redirected somewhere, you can get to the redirect page itself by either clicking on the redirect or pressing the back button, I forget which. In mobile mode, I’m just plain unable to land on the redirect page, no matter what, and therefore seem to have no way to delete it. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:20, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
This won't be fun, but you can try it: if the redirect is "USA", copy the URL into the search box. That should stop it from redirecting automatically. Just replace the "USA" with whatever you choose in that case. Should work. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 04:37, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
I think that phab:T150189 is the correct task, and it looked like User:Jdlrobson was (a long time ago) looking for a good explanation of why anyone would want to do that. Jon, is that the correct task for "As an admin, I need to be able to reach the redirect so I can delete it from my phone"? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 05:01, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Editing News #1—July 2019[edit]

Swept in from the pub

18:32, 23 July 2019 (UTC)


@Traveler100: Are there any more plans for this expedition? --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 17:04, 6 August 2019 (UTC)

Concrete specific plans, I am not sure. Personally I would like to move the mobile version improvements forward, particularly with interactive map, but that is past my technical knowledge area. --Traveler100 (talk) 01:11, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
I see. If only we could find some new person with good technical knowledge. Maybe someone connected to the WMF. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 12:35, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

Wikivoyage:Don’t tout red linking[edit]

Swept in from the pub

Why is it doing that? This is showing up as a red link on my iPhone 6S. Does it red link for you? Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:25, 24 August 2019 (UTC)

For the same reason it's a pain in the neck to italicize or bold-ify text when editing on my phone: because iPhones default to curly quotes, but the apostrophe in Wikivoyage:Don't tout (and those used to denote bold and italic text in MediaWiki markup) are straight. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:46, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
Yeah, that's terrible, isn't it? Couldn't we create a redirect to fix that problem? --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 18:01, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
Yeah, it’s terrible for iPhones to edit “defectively” by default. And since we can’t expect people to all somehow change what their iPhones do, it’s imperative to fix the problem in MediaWiki markup. Or should I simply stop editing every time I am without my laptop and/or without Wi-Fi? That’s not a solution, but at present, others not on iPhones will have to do followup edits after me... Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:35, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
@Ikan Kekek: Thank you - you inspired me to finally seek out a solution to this problem. On your iPhone, go to Settings > General > Keyboard and then turn Smart Punctuation off. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 00:15, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
Done. Now, if I could only find an easy way to place my cursor in the middle of any word on my iPhone... Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:13, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
That issue with the cursor is literally one of the most annoying features of Apple products. Fortunately, 'my' iPad -belonging to my former employer - 'had to' be returned last week (oh, the pain!) as part of moving on to a new job.
I've made the redirect, as we should do our best to make Wikivoyage compatible with all operating systems. Off the top of your heads, can anyone remember any other policy page titles with an apostrophe, that may default to the fancy curly type on iOS? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 08:52, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
What about Wikivoyage:Travellers' pub? How does that work with the other kind of apostrophe? --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 12:54, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
Wikivoyage:Travellers’ pub. It was redlinking, but not anymore.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 13:07, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
Thanks, Thundering! Ikan Kekek (talk) 13:53, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
The "wrong" versions of "Don't tout" and "don't tout" should also be redirected. Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:15, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

If you want to do this comprehensively, then there are about 325 titles in the mainspace (including redirects) and 39 in the project space (including four redirects). I'm not sure that every single one of these needs a redirect from curly quotes. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:54, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

I would say that anything in articlespace can be redirected as and when it's needed. It would make sense to do the policy pages, however.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 17:45, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
Yes --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 18:31, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

Quality ratings on mobile[edit]

Swept in from the pub

I've been browsing WV on mobile a bunch recently, and one thing I've been missing is the quality ratings (star, guide, outline, etc.) at the bottom — they're a really useful piece of context that helps me discern whether to treat what I'm reading as authoritative collective wisdom or the musings of the one editor who's ever been to the place. Would it be possible to add these to the mobile edition? Sdkb (talk) 05:18, 9 September 2019 (UTC)

They're not missing on my mobile browser (Chrome). The template only displays in a basic text format, but it's still enough to know what level an article is. Which browser are you using? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 06:49, 9 September 2019 (UTC)
I see the text when you expand the Go next section. As you say just text, we need to look at having some form of box boarder around the text in mobile mode. --Traveler100 (talk) 07:26, 9 September 2019 (UTC)
I'm now in mobile mode on a desktop computer, and I am using the Firefox browser. The status information is showing up with a border as well. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 21:09, 10 September 2019 (UTC)
Oops, silly me, I just didn't think to expand that last section. I guess ideally the box should appear outside that section, as it's not part of "Go next", but that's a more minor issue. Sdkb (talk) 16:06, 12 September 2019 (UTC)

Bottom of pages in mobile[edit]

In mobile mode the sections are by default collapses and the last section (often Go next) includes info boxes like the article status. Is there anyway to get {{Stbox}} to always display even when the last section is not expanded? --Traveler100 (talk) 17:39, 2 November 2019 (UTC)