Talk:Nassau County

Gang violence

Is there really any basis for saying that gang violence is rampant in Freeport? I'm sure there has been an occasional incident in northeast Freeport, but "rampant"? - Jmabel (talk) 06:38, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

If you see something you know to be untrue, please plunge forward and edit it out. Thanks. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:07, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

Organization

I feel like having a subpage for every village is overkill, except for the ones that have an especially large concentration of points of interest. I think that it would be better to organize the county around North Shore, Nassau Hub, and South Shore regions. Thoughts? Antony-22 (talk) 19:24, 2 April 2016 (UTC)

Are you suggesting additional region articles about those regions? On the face of it, I'm not sure. But I don't think it's a good idea to have templated listings in this article. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:57, 2 April 2016 (UTC)

What I mean is, Nassau County is divided into over 135 different villages, and that level of balkanization of articles isn't very user-friendly. I think it would be much better to organize the sub-articles around a reasonable number of regions rather than 100+ villages. Montgomery County (Maryland) would be a good analogy. (Any well-known municipalities with many features of interest such as Glen Cove or Garden City could still have their own articles, but there's not much to write about in a place like Albertson or Lynbrook.) North/Hub/South is a fairly obvious breakdown, but different divisions could work too. Antony-22 (talk) 21:13, 2 April 2016 (UTC)

Looking at Wikivoyage:Geographical hierarchy, it says that it's good to have about 7 subdivisions to each level of hierarchy. I could definitely suggest that number of regions as an intermediate level between the county and the ~135 villages. Antony-22 (talk) 21:59, 2 April 2016 (UTC)

We definitely don't need 135 articles for Nassau County. Wikivoyage:What is an article is a good reference. But I'm not convinced we need 7 region articles for Nassau County. We could more clearly answer the question of whether we do or not if you'd post a list of villages (etc.) that would merit an article and what region you'd put them in. Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:28, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

My impression is that the village boundaries are of little use to travelers; they're essentially arbitrary administrative lines, aren't they? As such, it might make sense to just divide Nassau County into 7-9 bottom-level regions and cities. Powers ^(talk) 19:54, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

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Well, there are a couple of choices. Nassau County's top-level divisions are three towns and two cities (Hempstead, North Hempstead, Oyster Bay, Glen Cove, Long Beach). The towns are then further subdivided into all those villages. So we could use the five towns/villagescities, but they're not entirely ideal because the cities are much smaller than the towns, and Oyster Bay straddles the North Shore/South Shore split. So I would propose the following divisions:

• North Hempstead
• Glen Cove plus northern Oyster Bay (this could be further separated into the regions near Glen Cove and near Oyster Bay village)
• southern Oyster Bay
• Nassau Hub
• Outer Barrier (everything on Long Beach Island and Jones Beach Island)
• Rest of Hempstead, perhaps split into eastern Hempstead and western Hempstead

That would make for between 6 and 8 regions. Of course, I'm open to suggestions. Antony-22 (talk) 20:53, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

How many village articles would you put in each region? Or would you propose to merge everything from villages within these regions into these articles? Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:39, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

I think that very few of the villages have enough points of interest to merit an article. Most of them are just a bunch of houses. Some, like Cove Neck, have one big point of interest (Sagamore Hill) but little else. Some of them have multiple historic sites or have a notable business district. I would guess that about 20 of them might merit their own articles. I'm not really experienced enough with Wikivoyage to know whether it's better to just have region articles, or to also allow articles for the subset of villages that could have their own articles. I'm fine with either. Antony-22 (talk) 23:55, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

If you don't plan on further subdividing an article, it doesn't get the Wikivoyage:Region article template, but instead would be treated as a city article. It's fine to cover attractions in nearby villages, if that's what serves the traveler best. In that case, the fact that an article also covers the neighboring villages of X, Y and Z should be mentioned in the lede. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:29, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

I see what you mean. I guess there would be about 15–20 "village clumps" that have one dominant village plus a few nearby villages that are less interesting. Is this better or worse than having the 6–8 articles based roughly on subdivisions of towns as described above?

FWIW I'd suggest the following as a first draft of what the "notable" villages are: Great Neck, Port Washington, Roslyn, Glen Cove, Oyster Bay, Floral Park, Garden City, Hempstead, Hicksville, Farmingdale, Valley Stream, Rockville Center, Freeport, Merrick, Massapequa, Five Towns, Long Beach. Antony-22 (talk) 22:52, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

Better or worse? I don't know. Have you looked at all the current articles for towns/villages (etc.) in Nassau County? Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:45, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

We really need more participation in this discussion, as two people do not constitute a consensus, even if we were to agree. User:LtPowers, User:AndreCarrotflower, User:PerryPlanet, User:Daniel Case, User:WheelGun, User:MacftraxMC: Do you all have any views about the discussion Antony-22 and I have been having in this thread? Anyone else? Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:46, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

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(reindent) I have only very basic familiarity with Long Island, but is there any reason why we can't simply treat the towns/cities as bottom-level destination articles? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:23, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for opening up the conversation. The points against it are the large variation in sizes (Long Beach has pop. 33k and 2 sq mi., while Hempstead has 760k and 120 sq mi.), plus the fact that Oyster Bay straddles the distinct North and South Shore regions. These aren't insurmountable, but I'm suggesting combining Long Beach with the surrounding coastal regions of Hempstead, splitting the rest of Hempstead two or three ways due to its size, and splitting Oyster Bay into north and south parts. That gets you more or less the districts bullet-pointed above. Antony-22 (talk) 02:16, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Why wouldn't splitting Hempstead confuse travellers? Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:10, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

I don't see why it would. Hempstead is, literally, the most populous civil township in the nation. It it were a city it would be the second largest city in New York State, three times the size of Buffalo, and the 16th largest in the US. It's typical for Wikivoyage to split up municipalities of that size.

Oyster Bay has a similar population to places like Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, and Saint Paul. Many of those cities have a single article, but some are split even at that size. South Oyster Bay is more similar to what you find in Hempstead than in the rest of Oyster Bay, so it would be a clear way to split it, but I won't be pushy if people would rather keep them in a single article. Antony-22 (talk) 19:02, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

The cities you mention have metropolitan areas with very large populations. Hempstead is part of the New York Metropolitan Area. Note that neither Cincinnati nor Saint Paul is districted on this site, but I really don't see the comparison as relevant. I think the key point here is that the Town of Hempstead is divided into 22 villages. Any village that merits an article can have one, and it's completely normal to have an article about a village (town, whatever - Wikivoyage isn't big on official designations) to state in the lead "This article also covers the neighboring villages of W, X, Y and Z". Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:23, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Like I said, there are about 15–20 viable village articles. I'm fine with that too. I think I've said what I need to say, I'd like to let others weigh in too. Antony-22 (talk) 02:33, 7 April 2016 (UTC)

Honestly, I think 15–20 is too many subdivisions. That level of balkanization would make it hard for readers to get a quick sense of what points of interest are where. After all, Queens has six divisions and Brooklyn has eight, and Wikivoyage:Geographical hierarchy#Dividing geographical units says to aim for the 5–9 range. I'll keep any existing village articles that are developed (most of them are completely empty) but I'll start working on modified town/city based articles as the primary subdivisions of the county. Antony-22 (talk) 20:21, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Another option is to subdivide Nassau into a 2-3 regions (e.g., Northern, perhaps Central, and Southern Nassau County), with 5-10 bottom-level articles linked to each one. Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:51, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

I approve of what you're doing. I think that North Hempstead will probably need to be subdivided, because first of all, it's a pretty large area to traverse in visiting points of interest, especially for anyone who arrives by LIRR, and I could also imagine Great Neck by itself or in combination with Manhasset and Port Washington potentially having a bunch of "Eat" listings. But these things can always be taken care of later, if need be, after the content is up. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:43, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Format of listings

Anthony, while you continue to add more listings that will be moved to the appropriate bottom-level articles later, please do not include the zip code (which doesn't really help people find it) or the name of the state, which are defaults. Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:43, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Can do. I'll go back and fix the current items too. Antony-22 (talk) 23:10, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

More articles for the villages?

I was wondering if we should have more articles for just the villages themself. Obviously, I wouldn’t make them all, but would that be possible? JTZegers (talk) 16:54, 28 May 2021 (UTC)