Talk:Nordic monarchies
Add topicLatest comment: 3 years ago by LPfi in topic Norway and Denmark?
Gustavus Adolphus sites outside Sweden
[edit]Should sites related to the most famous Swedish king in history outside current Swedish borders be listed in this article, too? Hobbitschuster (talk) 23:05, 8 August 2021 (UTC)
- IMO, this article should focus on the monarchic institution, or at least the reigning house of Bernadotte. Sites related to historical kings would probably go better in Nordic history or Swedish Empire. /Yvwv (talk) 13:17, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
- Agree with Yvwv here. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 13:22, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
Norway and Denmark?
[edit]Should we include Norway and Denmark in this article and give it the name Scandinavian monarchies? Or would those monarchies be best served by individual articles? /Yvwv (talk) 23:57, 27 September 2021 (UTC)
- I personally think it'd be better if it were a collective article. We could include a little bit about the failed attempts of the Finnish Monarchy, but that's something to decide later. Pinging @Erik den yngre, LPfi, Ypsilon: about this. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 00:02, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- We could mention the Finnish one, yes. But much more important for Finland was the position 1809–1919, i.e. from when it became part of the Russian Empire until it got its new constitution. It was declared a republic on 6 December 1917, but as there was no new constitution yet, the monarchists (in majority as many republicans were missing because of the civil war) elected king based on the old Swedish one, kind of still in effect, as the emperors had declared Finland would keep its Swedish law. We have a few imperial lodges and an imperial train (and probably a host of other sites) intended for and used by the Grand Duke, i.e. the Emperor. And yes, I think handling the monarchies collectively would be nice and appropriate. –LPfi (talk) 05:35, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- If merged, I think this article should also cover a little about Iceland's monarchy too. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 06:58, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- We could mention the Finnish one, yes. But much more important for Finland was the position 1809–1919, i.e. from when it became part of the Russian Empire until it got its new constitution. It was declared a republic on 6 December 1917, but as there was no new constitution yet, the monarchists (in majority as many republicans were missing because of the civil war) elected king based on the old Swedish one, kind of still in effect, as the emperors had declared Finland would keep its Swedish law. We have a few imperial lodges and an imperial train (and probably a host of other sites) intended for and used by the Grand Duke, i.e. the Emperor. And yes, I think handling the monarchies collectively would be nice and appropriate. –LPfi (talk) 05:35, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
The King of Sweden was also king of Norway 1814-1905 (Norway had its own constitution). Indeed, Oslo's main street is called Karl Johan, originally Jean-Baptiste Bernadotte, Napoleon's general! The Swedish king is still sitting on his horse in front of the royal palace. So the Swedish monarchy is very much Norwegian history too. --Erik den yngre (talk) 07:29, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- Well, given the intertwined history of the Nordic countries during much of the history it could make sense to have a common article. Finland's "own" monarchy with Friedrich Karl could be mentioned but it's not such an important event in the history. The century of Russian rule in Finland has more to do with Russian history than the Nordic countries so I'm not sure if we would even need to mention it here. --Ypsilon (talk) 13:46, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- The Russian century was very important for Finland, also as a Nordic country, but whether it interests those interested in Nordic monarchies is another question of course. Personally I thin having traces of the Russian Emperor in the Nordic countries is interesting. Friedrich Karl is more interesting in the context of the Finnish-German relations leading to the Continuation War than as a monarch, but the monarchists in Finland did have a lasting impact. They wanted a strong leader to avoid anything like the Civil War, and although they did not get a king, they did get a strong presidency – UKK's role might have been to their liking – and they got presidential symbols resembling those of a monarch, such as the presidential castle in Helsinki.
- –LPfi (talk) 14:34, 28 September 2021 (UTC)
- Well, given the intertwined history of the Nordic countries during much of the history it could make sense to have a common article. Finland's "own" monarchy with Friedrich Karl could be mentioned but it's not such an important event in the history. The century of Russian rule in Finland has more to do with Russian history than the Nordic countries so I'm not sure if we would even need to mention it here. --Ypsilon (talk) 13:46, 28 September 2021 (UTC)