User talk:Gorilla Jones/Archives 2008-2009

This is an archive of discussions on my talk page from 2008 and 2009. If anything here requires further discussion, please take it to my current talk page.

Happy New Years!

I felt like saying...between you and Peter, you two successfully created 10 star articles this year. Congratulations! Looking forward to more in '08... (WT-en) PerryPlanet 22:09, 31 December 2007 (EST)

Stars

Yep, hoopla no mucho, but hey we've got our names on a book cover! --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 00:18, 8 March 2008 (EST)

Japan

Just out of curiosity, but did you recently return to the U.S. from Japan? -- (WT-en) Sapphire • (Talk) • 17:55, 9 March 2008 (EDT)

Fish crack

I figured the music fiends might get hungry, besides, it's watered down with a purple fedora. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 16:48, 2 July 2008 (EDT)

Greetings

Hi, I'm new, so I may be going about this all wrong, but I deleted tombstone from the upcoming projects on collaboration of the week. It didn't meet the criteria or it being usable and there has to be 5 suggestions on how to improve it. I've never been there, so what did you have in mind? Thanks (WT-en) Kire1975 22:48, 22 July 2008 (EDT)

Boston Districts

I'm soliciting advice, particularly as regards the process, on how to district Boston from both you and Peter as you have been through this. When you get the time, please let me know of any guidance you can offer. Pleas see Talk:Boston#DISTRICTS (again). Thanks. (WT-en) OldPine 12:41, 27 July 2008 (EDT)

Admin nomination

Hey, I just nominated User:(WT-en) LtPowers for sysop status. I'd appreciate it if you would comment here. Thanks! --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 19:02, 17 August 2008 (EDT)

Ireland Vandalism

Just to let you know Jones that someone has removed all the content from the ireland travel guide. Thank you. --72.73.79.217 19:52, 25 October 2008 (EDT)

Thanks. I will restore Ireland to its former glory. (WT-en) Gorilla Jones 20:31, 25 October 2008 (EDT)

Obama-mania

Yeah, I've been thinking we should try and cash in on this too. I could certainly put together an itinerary of Obama hotspots, although it wouldn't be terribly long (that might be a good thing, actually). The one downside would of course be that no one's allowed to visit his street anymore! Hopefully that will die down after the inauguration.

I'm not sure where we should put our Obama touting in the understand section though—maybe an expanded bit on his election in the African-American History section? Or in the general city history section? --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 00:56, 20 November 2008 (EST)

Nice work on those index edits too, by the way. I hate our index as well, but have shied away from that kind of dedication in fixing it! --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 01:07, 20 November 2008 (EST)

Tracking closings

Mind if I ask your method for keeping track of restaurant closings? I usually don't catch them until I happen to drive by them (which clearly doesn't work for, say, Beverly). --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 20:44, 9 December 2008 (EST)

Explain

Explain to me why you think Winnipeg is guide? A lot of the actual listings have very little information and then the other part just gives basic info, little addresses, websites, how to pay, how to get in, reservations, etc. So that is why I put it at usable because of those reasons - it's listings don't help the traveller beyond the usable criteria! (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 00:23, 12 December 2008 (EST).

Routebox navigation

Hi there. I have proposed a new route-based navigation system and implemented it for a test region. Everyone seems really anxious to start rolling this out, but I want to make sure our strongest contributors like you are behind this, since it may very well sweep the site. The discussion is now here. If you could give it a whirl and let me know your thoughts, I would be grateful. Thanks in advance! (WT-en) Texugo 12:03, 14 December 2008 (EST)

Vladivostok map

Yeah, I'd be happy to. The main obstacle would be source material, since I won't be able to do it from satellite. Open street map has some work done on the downtown, though I couldn't judge whether it's good enough. Why don't you take a look at it and if it's up to snuff, let me know the street borders of what you'd like me to draw. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 23:14, 21 December 2008 (EST)

In relation to that, did you spend any time in Khabarovsk? it's one of the cities on my to-do list, and I've already been doing a bit of work on it - help would be appreciated --(WT-en) Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 07:03, 22 December 2008 (EST) :)

Why did you delete my edit??

Hi, I noticed that you deleted a new section "Read" in Bangkok. Why did you do that?? Thanks

Itsukushima Shrine Picture

Just wanted to kindly invite your input here. (WT-en) Jtesla16 12:02, 9 January 2009 (EST)

I Appreciate the Feedback

Thanks for the input, Gorilla. I'm hell bent on getting Colorado's Wine Country chosen as an OtBP. It would be great for my area. Please keep me informed on what I need to add to help this article make the cut. Am I really going to have to write destination guides for all the other communities listed in Colorado's Wine Regions, as suggested by (WT-en) AHeneen? Honestly, would it help the article along if I just cut this section for now? This is an awfully tall order to fulfill, but I suppose it's doable. The photothis photo you're concerned about is in the public domain; I am not sure about a model release. I have pretty much exhausted the Wine Industry Development Board's photo library, so I will have to scrounge around a bit, or run out to the vineyards and take some more pix.(WT-en) WineCountryInn 19:46, 9 January 2009 (EST) ^Talk

Hi Gorilla, a quick update about Colorado's Wine Country: Winery listings cleaned up, unique descriptions added. Copy edited as per MoS, and infoboxes added. Is there anything else I should do? Thanks for all your help! (WT-en) WineCountryInn 18:05, 13 January 2009 (EST) ^Talk

Hi Gorilla, a quick update about Mandarmani: Sleep Listing had a double listing for the same resort with two different names. Debraj Resort and Mandarmoni Beach Resort was pointing to the same resort, URL and phone number listed in the resort site. So I deleted "Mandarmoni Beach Resort". I have cleaned up the "Mandarmani Beach Resort" entry cleaned up. Thanks for maintaining the page. 23:16, 13 March 2009 (EST) <Roger

Vladivostok map

Lest you think I forgot. I've actually already got the street map completed, but have been waiting on the icons to see what develops on the Russian version of the article, which is coming along pretty well. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 13:57, 26 February 2009 (EST)

Non-Stop Flights

Thanks for the suggestion. I never thought about it but I think it makes sense- for bigger cities I could list it on the airport page and for smaller with the city. Just learning how this works. Thanks

Tamaletwitter

Have you seen this? --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 21:25, 5 April 2009 (EDT)

And on a totally unrelated note, I notice that you rolled back this edit —to me that looked like a legitimate removal of an off-topic rant. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 21:46, 5 April 2009 (EDT)

Rosemont redirection

Based on a snap judgment and limited area knowledge—please revert. Listing the hotels twice does strike me as sub-optimal, though. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 23:51, 16 April 2009 (EDT)

More generally, I'm pretty unfamiliar with the Chicago suburbs, aside from Lake Co., Indiana. Please do go through and fix up any gross errors I'm making. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 23:53, 16 April 2009 (EDT)

Main Page Talk reversion

I noticed you removed my request from this page. I would like to discuss something with whoever is in charge. Would this be possible?

Please reply at this account's talk page. (WT-en) Tony X Liu 12:32, 20 April 2009 (EDT)

Hi Gorilla, You just remove my friend's information. Wikivoyage welcomes busines owners shttp://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wikivoyage:Welcome,_business_owners

-)

Yes, I've read it, although I suspect you didn't make it past the title! Best wishes to you and your friend... (WT-en) Gorilla Jones 00:54, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

Chicago/Loop

Any chance I could persuade you to take a look at rewriting parts of the Loop understand section? My, ah, hedge fund triumphalism seems a little awkward these days. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 05:05, 28 April 2009 (EDT)

What's this?

What are the "WEB-START" and "WEB-END" comments you've added to some articles? (WT-en) Texugo 04:27, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

Greeting from China

Hi Gorilla Jones, I just came back a few days ago from a business trip to Tibet for my company's stuff. How are you? I found that someone has added tourguide names in the pages but I have removed them according the rules. But here I really want to talk about the rules with you again. It says "In general, if a traveler could fulfill the substance of the tour on their own, the tour should not be listed on Wikivoyage." I think travelers can't fulfill the substance of the tour on their own easily in here. If they are not backpackers they probably need a good guide to tour them around. Actully many travelers are looking for guides here but some of them are fooled by those guides on the street. It would be great if tour companies that are qualificated can list their names in the pages. Also wikivoyage gives 4 points to determine whether a tour should be listed in our guides. That's my opinion. Lily in China

Kyoto Districts

I've added a couple of notes to Talk:Kyoto on the matter of moving to district sub-pages. Please let me know what you think. For my part, I think the main article is getting too long and unwieldy for its own good; it's probably time we spun off at least a couple of districts (to start) in order to improve readability. (Full disclosure: I'm posting this same message on the Talk pages of other users who have actively participated on Talk:Kyoto in the past. No spamming intended.) --(WT-en) Diego de Manila 21:12, 22 May 2009 (EDT)

Spambots everywhere

Just curious - what makes Awhiteeq1 look like a spambot? It's not a ten-character name with the first and sixth letters capitalized, like all the other bots that have been causing trouble this week, so I was wondering if I missed something. - (WT-en) Dguillaime 21:49, 22 May 2009 (EDT)

re Calgary

Hi there, please leave the Calgary thing alone. I will edit it further soon, and it'll have more "useful information". I hope that's okay. I will revert your reversion, please don't take it as an edit war. Thanks. (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 16:11, 23 May 2009 (EDT).

Hey, Jones. What I said to EE applies to you, too. There's no reason to revert repeatedly like that; all it does is spread bad feelings around. (WT-en) LtPowers 17:09, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

That is incorrect and wrongheaded. When a user is edit warring to delete content, continually reverting his/her edits is appropriate per Project:Consensus#Status quo bias. If it continues to too great an extent, protecting the page can be appropriate, if regrettable, per Project:Protected_page_policy#Reasons to protect a page. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 17:21, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

I don't see what Status Quo Bias has to do with this situation. That's talking about situations where "a consensus becomes impossible"; here there was no attempt at consensus-building, just two people reverting each other back and forth. That's not productive and engenders hard feelings. (WT-en) LtPowers 19:00, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

It means you don't get to delete a swathe of useful information in an article, and "I'll write something different later" isn't a valid excuse for deleting it again. (WT-en) Gorilla Jones 19:10, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

Marc was reverting to the status quo version, and his handling of the situation could not be more rote and established. Moreover, see Project:How to handle unwanted edits#Repeat offenses. LtPowers, I've got to level with you, I've been biting my tongue hard with regards to your handling of this issue, which throughout has struck me as either unfamiliar with or in opposition to both our (unusually lenient among wikis) policies on handling unwanted edits, as well as basic wiki practices beyond and including those of our site. Moreover, I think you have been dramatically out of step with the rest of the administrators here at nearly every step of the way, and I think this should be obvious from several dramatic debacles that I don't believe I need to link to here. Your continued snide remarks to and "lecturing" of other administrators who are a good deal more experienced than you at handling unwanted edits, as well as your apparent belief that "moderating" between other administrators and users defying policy is useful, is deleterious to this site and in my view most unwelcome.

When you find your handling of a situation is degenerating into something controversial and provocative of bad relations between regular editors, it is a good idea to step back from the situation completely and to let others handle it. I recommend you do this. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 19:15, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

I appologize for the way I edited I suppose. I don't see it as a big deal, just be patient. If it's a day and I haven't done anything then yeah I'd revert. I understand what you guys are all getting at, and since I'm no admin, and I do not have a strong disagreeance with it, I'll abide by it. Peter, we don't need to drag old stuff (even though you didn't provide links) into this. Lets just move on. Just because one has more time on this site, doesn't mean they aren't as legitamate a mod. Not every mod has to agree on the same thing - or at least that's my thought. LtPowers, you have done a great job at talking to me about this stuff, so please don't stop unless you don't want to. Any how, again sorry, lets not keep building on the issue, and make it a big fanatical. Let's just, as others have said in other spots, get back to writing travel guides ;). Something we're all good at. (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 22:08, 23 May 2009 (EDT).

Fallas

I just moved the Fallas from the Valencia article to a separate article. What was wrong? --(WT-en) Mariusm98 17:06, 23 May 2009 (EDT) Sorry, I see consensus is on your side, I just thought the Valencia article looked too messy, and was inspired by the Barcelona talk page: "And please consider starting an article like New Year holidays in Hungary when you're back--share whatever experience you gain. If you need help, try asking me. --DenisYurkin 16:54, 20 December 2008"

Thanks

Thanks for 'speedying' the deletion of that page. (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 19:08, 27 May 2009 (EDT).

Abkhazia

Mate, I have seen that you reverted the mass deletion of 94.43.221.10 in Abkhazia. This user is very persistent in deleting this article (have a look in is contribution that only lists deleting Abkhazia). As you have the magic buttons as admin, could you please block him? Peter reverted him yesterday but i think the contributor starts to be annoying... Thanks,(WT-en) jan 03:40, 8 June 2009 (EDT)

He's only recently started using a static ip—so I assume he'll just revert to using an open proxy or whatever it was beforehand if we block him. Anyway, it's not too hard to just keep reverting, since there are many regular contributors keeping an eye on it throughout the day, and only one of him. He'll likely just get bored and move on. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 04:22, 8 June 2009 (EDT)

Ok, then I keep reverting, too but Abkhazia is a sensitive topic so let's hope he gets bored sooner than later...(WT-en) jan 05:15, 8 June 2009 (EDT)

Shikoku map

Gorgeous Shikoku map, but the position of Kubokawa is way off -- it's near the coast due north of Cape Ashizuri, right about where the railway line bends. The actual railway terminus, where you've placed Kubokawa now, is Sukumo. You might also want to add in Mount Ishizuchi while you're at it, and Awaji Island with its links to Honshu (via Naruto) seems to be missing entirely? (WT-en) Jpatokal 00:00, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

Awaji is connected by bridge though and there are lots of buses from Kansai, so IMHO it's worth showing. (WT-en) Jpatokal 01:08, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

Oh, if only the onions were all fine -- I still have nightmares of being chased around Awaji by a katana-wielding yakuza midget while suffering from food poisoning, hangover, and clouds of rotting onion stink. Fer real. (WT-en) Jpatokal 03:43, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

Chugoku

Aside from the nine and the added two you mentioned, I suppose I'd suggest Yamaguchi (since it's the capital of the prefecture) as a must. As far as what I will work on, there are probably not any new cities, although I'd like to start a page for Daisen/Mount Daisen. Cities that may fit nicely on the map could be Kurayoshi (also it gives Tottori prefecture a second city), Hamada, Masuda, Takahashi, or Tsuyama. I'd like to suggest Oda, because that is the location of Iwami Ginzan, but Iwami Ginzan is currently listed under Iwami which is not a city. I brought that up on the Votes for Deletion page, but no one has commented. Anyways, I guess I don't have so much to add, but I can't wait to see the new map! (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 22:20, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

Great job on the Chugoku map! I wasn't sure how much space there would be for cities, but there's a lot more than I thought. I noticed you also did a map for Shikoku. Are you doing maps for all of the regions? (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 13:17, 15 June 2009 (EDT)

Hiroden map

Neat! One nitpicky detail, though - should the "Miyajima" box pick up a subtitle of "Hiroden-miyajima-guchi" to reflect the station's name on local maps? The article text is already a little unclear on the Miyajima/Miyajimaguchi distinction, so I guess it's a question of whether it would increase confusion.

(Additionally but unrelatedly, thanks for cleaning up the silliness on my talk/user pages earlier.) - (WT-en) Dguillaime 13:24, 14 June 2009 (EDT)

Nusa_Lembongan

Marc, first thanks that you have started to take care of the mess in the NL article. I try for almost a year to keep this article from deteriorating (see talk page). Especially the Mainski and some other resorts are rather persistent. Is it possible to limit changes in this article only to registered contributers for a while (2 weeks up to a month)? I cleaned up some other places where i have been on holidays (e.g. Samui) but this is the only place where i have not been successful in combatting the obvious spammer...(WT-en) jan 09:59, 18 June 2009 (EDT)

I have tried to do a clean up of Nusa_Lembongan over the past 3 days. It sure was a bit of mess and I can see a troubled history there. I have removed a number of inaccuracies (I visit the tiny island 2 or 3 times a month and know it pretty well) as well as trying to standardise the page. I hope the article now reads better and the spammers stay away for a while. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 08:00, 28 July 2009 (EDT)

Wi-Fi or wireless internet

I notice in this edit , you changed "Wi-Fi" to wireless internet. I think Wi-Fi is better, and I've given reasons at Project:Abbreviations, and would be interested if you disagree. --(WT-en) inas 19:18, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

Sure, perhaps you could make that point at Project:Abbreviations, and we can see if there are other opinions. Are you advocating replacing Wi-Fi where it occurs with wireless internet everywhere? I prefer words to jargon too, but Wi-Fi is commonly used in these contexts, Coffee Shops without exception advertise free Wi-Fi, free WiFi returns 78,000,000 hits on google. Its not exactly fringe. --(WT-en) inas 19:35, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

Poolad Kaf

I noticed you deleted this page. Would a merge/redirect be more appropriate. --(WT-en) inas 20:31, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

I disagree. Our deletion policy clearly favors redirection over deletion, especially when we are not furthering any commercial interest. There is precedent for ski resorts in wt. --(WT-en) inas 21:29, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

You quote the policy rather selectively:-)! The preceding line says The rule of thumb is, if it is a real place, redirect rather than delete. It is a real place, and it isn't commercial in the sense a hotel is, or in the sense I believe the policy intended. We've redirected obscure attractions before. We've redirected ski resorts before. The effect of the policy in action is that if it is a real attraction, we generally redirect it. I don't really understand your case against doing that, you moved the content, redirect the article to where the content now is. Simple! It helps the next person who tries to create the article, it helps the user concerned, it helps someone trying to find the content in future. --(WT-en) inas 21:51, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

I would also add that the content you merged into the destination article must retain its attribution, and the easiest way to do that is to maintain the original page as a redirect. (WT-en) LtPowers 21:58, 23 June 2009 (EDT)

URL Blacklisted

Hi,

I would like to ask you if you could remove the site redsevenleisure dot co dot uk from the blacklisted sites. I wasn´t aware I couldn´t add an external link to this site on the Get out or Do sections but just read the Wiki-Travel policies :-) Sorry about that, I didn´t think it was considered spam!

Thanks!

--User:(WT-en) Nivaria 20:23, 1 July 2009 (EDT)

Segou, Mali

Wondering why you changed the edits I made to External Links? I am new to this and admit I am still learning - what was wrong with what I added?:

Thanks!

--User:(WT-en) Whyyouareeye 14:55, 9 July 2009 (GMT)

Iya Valley

Sorry, the Iya Valley map was one of my early experiments using demis.nl, it's just points slapped on top of a static PNG and the original is a Gimp XCF file, not SVG. Just trace on top in Inkscape...? (WT-en) Jpatokal 22:17, 12 July 2009 (EDT)

Taxi man

Your mind is not alone in its boggling. When I saw that HP is "trendy" bit, I thought maybe I should offer him a tour of the neighborhood (or of a trendy neighborhood—I'm not sure). --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 01:11, 14 July 2009 (EDT)

Your Thoughts?

On A Simple English Wikivoyage? --71.254.110.148 21:00, 25 July 2009 (EDT)

I'm against it. I'm out to turn the whole thing into Jabberwocky. (WT-en) Gorilla Jones 23:28, 25 July 2009 (EDT)

Okayama

Thanks a lot for creating the map and adding descriptions for all the hotel listings! I sort of forgot about that as I've been busy with the Kyoto collaboration. The Okayama page looks so much more like a guide! (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 01:25, 27 July 2009 (EDT)

Improving Okayama

Your comments about the Okayama article on Matsuyama's Star Nomination made me wonder what your thoughts were about the page. Do you think there is a better way to organize it to make it easier for you to make maps, or do you think the problem is simply the city's layout/shape? Are there any attractions that you feel should be deleted from the page? Although lately I haven't had much time to work on articles, I would like to continue working to check off the "Push for Star" list you made on the page to get this up to star status, and I do appreciate your input, so anything about my questions or whatever other thoughts or comments you have about it, feel free to tell me.

Also, I don't know exactly how my writing is perceived on this site, but if my review of Matsuyama was offensive or too abrasive, I do want to appologize for that. (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 23:44, 6 September 2009 (EDT)

Hiroshima

Whoah, awesome three-page map! You could (slightly) reduce the pain of updating that by setting the key as print=fullpage and then the map as one file with print=split. (WT-en) Jpatokal 06:18, 17 August 2009 (EDT)

On an unrelated thought... When I visited last year, I was amused to discover that the ATMs at the central post office didn't have an English-language option -- it showed up on the screen, but the corresponding button was physically missing. This would probably be less amusing for a visitor that didn't read enough Japanese to work through the menus, though! If this is still true (and if my memory was correct to begin with), might it be worthwhile to add the location of a few foreigner-friendly ATMs? - (WT-en) Dguillaime 13:22, 17 August 2009 (EDT)

After 7-11 started accepting foreign withdrawals I don't think it's so much of a problem with finding ATM's any more, and there are no citibank atm's to plot in, as there are none. --(WT-en) Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 14:20, 17 August 2009 (EDT)

Tottori Map

You have been creating a lot of great maps lately!

Ochidani Shrine was placed outside of the city center, but it is located a short distance from Kannon-in. I also added the Yamabikokan (Tottori City History Museum), which is within the city center. I had noticed that it was missing only after I saw the uploaded map, so I appologize for that. I imagine it's rather annoying to have someone add destinations after the map is posted.

On a related note (since it would also be able to be placed on the map), Tottori has the Ekimae Market. Where does that get placed? I didn't go there, but it's basically a fish market with some fresh produce and a footbath (according to my guide). Are these types of places "Buy", "Eat", or "Do"s? (WT-en) ChubbyWimbus 15:52, 22 August 2009 (EDT)

I'll second the commendation on the great maps you're making. Great to see a map for Tottori! (WT-en) Texugo 01:52, 27 August 2009 (EDT)

Movies

That was brilliant ;) --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 03:23, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

Admin nom

Please comment on Sabino434's nomination. Thanks. -- 94.75.123.43 14:58, 5 November 2009 (EST)