Talk:Mount Rinjani

I cannot find a government or academic reference to an "eruption" in 1996 so I have edited the history section to show 1995 (1994-1995 instead of 1994-1996. Please see <http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/volcano.cfm?vnum=0604-03=&volpage=erupt> for a formal documentation of the history and abbreviated detail of rinjani eruptions. The wikipedia page on rinjani has a discription of formally recorded and documented eruption events including a table of those eruption events derived from formal sources. If anyone turns up formal documentation of an eruption event in 1996 then please post it also on the wikipedia discussion page to ensue the detail is not missed on that page at <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Rinjani>

If I am in error here and there was a formally documented eruption of rinjani in 1996 please correct the history section of the page to reflect that but if anyone does so please do ensure that the source is a formal one and perhaps post a link or academic citation to the information on this discussion page to ensure clarity. Please do not refer to internet sites that are simply parroting or cutting and pasting from pre may 2010 versions of either the wikivoyage rinjani page or the wikipedia rinjani page. It appears that most of the tourism and rinjani trekking pages are doing this, or just copying and pasting each others text.(WT-en) felix 05:48, 16 May 2010 (EDT)

"That repetitive detail ruined what is a very good article" ruined for ever or was the editing just delayed by a power outage?

Burmesedays I appreciate that you removed the typo repeating a date entry and also the repeat of part of the 1 May eruptive detail. However I do not think it "ruined the article". It just required an edit to adjust the text. Indeed it would not have been there for more than 30 seconds if I had not lost my internet connection on Monday morning seconds after I inadvertently uploaded the edit. I had been trying to preview a very preliminary draft but my internet connection was grindingly slow. Despite several tries I could not upload to the preview page as the connection was so slow. During the many retries I accidentally clicked on the Save page button by mistake uploading my early draft of an unfinished edit with the date typo and the repeat of the 1 May 2010 eruption detail.

I immediately saw the typo's when the page loaded but could not get back online to correct it because seconds later the power was turned off to my district. I remained off for an extended time so I gave up and went to the city. By the time I got back on-line later in the day you had already re-edited the section.

Like yourself I live in Indonesia and where I live the power goes off many times a day often for extended times, sometimes all day or all night, sometimes both. Indeed we lose our power most nights with it frequently going off just before dusk. In the last few days it has been turned on and off 10-15 times or more during the day. Also lately Telkom has been providing an even slower ADSL connection than normal and a lot of the time I cannot even download a page. Yesterday our power went off ant 07:00 in the morning and did not come back on until the evening, then came on for about 30-40 minutes and then went off again for an extended time into the night.

So thanks for cleaning up the text I uploaded, I did not intend to leave it like that. The clumsy edit just arose from an accident uploading it and I could not get online again for many hours to remedy the typos in it.

Burmesedays did you think you were deleting repetition when you deleted "March 2010 plumes rose 500 metres (1,640 ft) - 900 metres (2,953 ft)". That was a different event. Some travellers may be interested in the recent eruptive detail especially if they are planning a Rinjani trek. At least if there is reasonably current information information on in the article it can assist potential visitors to be better informed in their enquiries with the trekking and tour providers.

Also setting aside the upload error and the power outage I do not think updating the article to reflect subsequent and current events to 2010 is going to "ruin" the article. Rinjani is an active volcano with tour groups wandering about on it. Information in the article should be current is possible. I think your comments about the page being "ruined" were a little excessive.

Also you have removed some information that many travellers may find important, such as the aviation advisory detail and some of the eruptive info like the ash eruptions and ejected incandescent material being ejected and falling in and about the caldera in the beginning of May 2010.

Burmesedays you also deleted the distance conversions, I share a dislike of the cluttered typography that results from these conversions. In fact I feel close to a teeth clenching moment just looking at the cluttered type that arises from stating measurements in two different standards. However there are people in the world who do not 'think' in metric measures and no doubt some who do not understand them at all . Hence Wikipaedia has a style guide and a policy on measurements. For clarity I have cut and pasted it below.

Provide conversions from <http://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Wikivoyage:Measurements>

It's easier for travelers to understand measurements if they're converted to their own country's units. For this reason, it's best to provide conversions for measurements into both metric and imperial, the two systems most widely used in the English-speaking world. If the preferred units are metric, provide imperial measurements in parentheses after. If the preferred units are imperial, provide metric measurements in parentheses. If for some reason the local unit is neither metric nor imperial, provide first metric then imperial in parentheses afterwards.

Burmesedays thank you for tidying up the edit when I could not get back on line but please understand not everyone who edits the page is going to just do a hit and run or vandalise it. A Wikivoyage article is by design always going to be a work in progress and accordingly may at times be in flux.(WT-en) felix 21:38, 18 May 2010 (EDT)

Recent events or Current events section (proposal for inclusion in the article)

I note that despite the CVGHM warnings and the establishing of the exclusion zone of 4 km radius about Barujari that trekking groups were still being taken to the crater lake shore and the hot springs yesterday (17-18 may 2010). I understand from talking to some of the trekkers returning from the slopes that the ash eruptions were not occurring yesterday. Earlier in the week over-night trekking campers were however apparently experiencing hot ash events. Maybe the History section needs to have an accompanying Recent or Current events section to complement it. When info is no longer current or topical in such a Current events section it could be moved henceforth to the History section or deleted if it is just transient info. This would allow visitors to be better informed as to things like eruptive events (derived from official rather than anecdotal sources) and also information such as aviation advisories, exclusion zones or route closures. Certainly if I was going to climb Rinjani I would find such information of interest including that of a report of Rinjani being placed on "Stand-ny Status" by CVGHM in May 2010

ie On 5 May 2010 a possible ash plume from Rinjani rose to an altitude of 5.5 km (18,000 ft) a.s.l. and drifted 150 km NW. Accordingly the Center of Volcanology and Geological Hazard Mitigation advised that intermittent activity could produce ash plumes to 1.5 km (5,000 ft) above the caldera.. A Yellow (Level 2-Advisory) aviation alert was raised.

I heard stories of ash landing in Montong so ash was possibly also travelling SW toward the airport and entering within the approach and departure corridors. Most people travelling to Lombok arrive by air and so the provision of authoritative information on the status of Aviation Ash Alerts alerts is appropriate. With the current attention to the volcanic ash clouds in the northern hemisphere it is even more likely that travellers or interested future travellers may seek or benefit from this information. I think the Aviation Alert information (when derived from authoritative sources such as VAAC or CVGHM) is in context both in a history section and in a proposed Current events or Recent events section. (WT-en) felix 21:35, 18 May 2010 (EDT)

I would suggest something like this probably belongs in the Understand section. I do not think it should be called "Recent events" or anything like that as it will be impossible to maintain. It should also be concise and not too detailed. When eruptive activity gets especially serious, then the current situation can go into a warning box. --(WT-en) Burmesedays 21:56, 18 May 2010 (EDT)

24 may eruption activity

Hi Burmesedays. Looks like my gut feeling on Rinjani was correct as it has been erupting with ash and small lava flows since saturday. Hence my earlier editing the page with the official alerts and advisories. I think we should consider putting back some of the info again with content updated to today. My information at the time was that the trekking and guide outfits were completely ignoring the advisories and taking people to the summit, the hot springs and the lake. Well they might be getting into some hot water or something even more exciting soon. I think we should have a think about the warning panel or the Current activity section I was proposing. Your suggestion of the warning panel is good but may be unnecessarily frightening to some at this time, where as a Current activity section may be more appropriate at this time and a panel if things really heat up (sorry could not resist that). I will look into the official reports in the next hour or so PLN permitting (already off 5 times today). FYI ...Also posted this note to Burmesedays talk page and hoping there will be no more talk of ruined pages :)(WT-en) felix 01:03, 24 May 2010 (EDT)(WT-en) felix 01:28, 24 May 2010 (EDT)

Sat phone number-not a working number

I removed sat phone number as it is not a working number (086812104132),(+086812104132), (+62 86812104132)

"Tidak didaptar (not a listed number)" or similar is the response I get when I try that number.

(+86812104132 is a non active number in china)

I tried from a tekom indonesia landline, a telkomsel SIM and an XL SIM. I assume the number that is spread all over the net on travel and trekking websites is just wrong. Certainly it does not work in any reasonable variation.

However the only friend of mine who has a sat phone in indonesia has the number +628681xxxxxxx. Indonesia Mobile Satelite (prefix 8681): Zone 6 is listed at <http://oteshop.ote.gr/oteshop/pdfs/ENTELEPHONY.pdf> You will note that is the same prefix as you posted so maybe they forgot pay their bill at Rinjani or maybe they dropped it in the lava flow.(WT-en) felix 04:57, 24 May 2010 (EDT)

PT Pasifik Satelit Nusantara: Baru, prefix: 08681.......(WT-en) felix 05:04, 24 May 2010 (EDT)

Rant about inexperienced guides etc

• I just added a few paragraphs in the "Basics" section on how to make sure the guides know what they're doing. This is based on my own experience; basically we got to one of the shelters, there was a flash thunderstorm, and these "guides" ended up shivering and cold, and so we had to turn back. (WT-en) Mugwump 00:00, 16 September 2010 (EDT)

Moved from article

The note below was originally a comment within the article - moving to the talk page, which is a more appropriate place for it:

Blinded the 'alternative' listing below due to hijacking by ip 202.70.58.115 on this page and the Senggigi page, this IP apparently acting on behalf of Lombok Holiday Tours and www.rinjanitrekkingclub.com

Hijacking similar to that performed by IP 202.70.58.115 was repeated again on 8 june 2010 by IP 202.70.58.152 including the removal of the earlier version of this explanatory information.

The IP 202.70.58.152 is from the same range as 202.70.58.115 that visited this page on 31 may 2010 and performed similar edits to those of 6 june 2010 on this article and also on the Lombok Senggigi article on the same day.

re: 202.70.58.152.

The Project Honey Pot system has detected behaviour from the IP address consistent with that of a mail server and dictionary attacker. Other data is associated with this IP. This interrelated data helps map spammers' networks and aids in law enforcement efforts. If you know something about this IP, please leave a comment at <http://www.projecthoneypot.org/ip_202.70.58.152?vid=i1fkn3a6of4nop0m8g1tsn1e57>.

The respective IP, and the IP range belongs to WIRELESS INDONESIA, PT SMART TELECOM, PT, country: ID, descr: Mobile Network Provider. Links, email addresses, phone numbers and physical addresses point to Domain Name: RINJANITREKKINGCLUB.COM - Registrant: PT.LOMBOK TROPIC HOLIDAYS TRAVEL SERVICE - Andi Hermansyah, Jl. Raya Senggigi 112, Senggigi, Batu Layar, Lombok Barat, 83355, Tel. +62.370692225, Fax. +62.370692225.<rtcsenaru@gmail.com>, :+62 (0) 817 5754 551 / (0) 8180 5712 752" The IP concerned is 72.52.162.209, registered to Lombok Holiday Tour at http://www.lombokholidaytour.com/. IP: 69.65.43.164. The activities of the individual associated with the respective IP occasionally uses the alias - Adietya - when flooding discussion boards and travel industry blogs with information about an 'alternative' rinjani trekking club and other related Lombok travel, tours and package information. A user - a_dudley - has also been associated with this IP 202.70.58.152.

A hijacking content example appears below:

Rinjani Trekking Club, Jl Raya Senaru - Bayan, North Lombok, ☏ +62 818 05712752, rtcsenaru@gmail.com. 

http://www.greenrinjani.com (info.greenrinjani@gmail.com|) (+6281916030327)

-- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 11:49, 28 April 2012 (EDT)

Trekking agencies

Given the warning about pre-booking present in this article, I've removed all listings without addresses in accordance with the Tour policy. Many of the remaining listings still look like they might be travel agencies, but hopefully someone with local knowledge can take a look and remove any that aren't companies that lead treks up the mountain. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 11:54, 28 April 2012 (EDT)

Similarly, I've been reverting the "Trekking Rinjani" listing (URL is the same as the company name) due to some issues related to changing competitor listings and other violations of Project:Don't tout. Unless/until that company can explain what happened in edits like this and this I'd recommend against including them in this article. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 19:51, 2 May 2012 (EDT)

The link that was deleted in the two edits you point to does not work for me; I get an error message that the site cannot be found. If it is dead, that would be a valid reason to delete it. However, I am in China so I cannot tell if t is actually dead or just blocked by the Great Firewall. Could someone else please check? (WT-en) Pashley 00:18, 3 May 2012 (EDT)

Both links worked for me. (WT-en) Ikan Kekek 00:27, 3 May 2012 (EDT)

I tidied things up a bit. Johns adventures is a long established provider and a key player on the mountain, he is on the main road running through Senaru. Rinjani Adventure is OK as well, it is operated by one of the previous people from the genuine Rinjani Trekking club, however we need to keep an eye on that listing as his name and web address are compromised by another operator (the same one referred to in the much earlier hijacking notes concerning Rinjani Trekking Club hijacks). In the case of Rinjani Adventure an 's' is added to the end of the URL, hence diverting the traffic to another operator. The correct address is http://www.rinjaniadventure.com/ (NOT http://www.rinjaniadventures.com/) as sometimes appears in various places. (WT-en) felix 19:42, 3 May 2012 (EDT)

New entrants

This new entrant has been moved across here as their depth of experience in trekking has yet to be clarified.

• Green Rinjani, Jl. Pariwisata, 83354 Senaru, Lombok, ☏ +6281916030327, info.greenrinjani@gmail.com. ' GREEN RINJANI LOMBOK.Trekking Organizer and planting a tree on the mount Rinjani with eco friendly solutions for tomorrow's environment.' 

This second listing was removed from the sub-section titled "Other activities":

• Andreas' expedition (www.andreasexpedition.com) has for example a day trip in Senaru and Bayan in it's program, a mix of nature and culture. The guests visit the traditional village in Senaru, make a walk through the rice paddies, take a bath in the two waterfalls of Senaru, visit the old mosque in Bayan and see the production of handicraft in this village - wonderful sarongs and scarfs. In the late afternoon the guests make a stop at the food market in Ancak and have the possibility to taste typical local food.

Hi Andreas and Sandra. Thank you for your contribution to article content in the Other activities sub-section, however the detail providing a listing for Andreas' expedition there as a provider has been removed.
The policy on tour or guide listings is that a listing is only permitted in an article if it is an activity that the traveller cannot, or may not do on their own. All those activities listed are accessible to an independent traveller.

However the Rinjani ascents are not open to an independent traveller, park regulations strictly demand that an accredited guide is used for any ascent. That is why this article lists the ascent guides, but like other articles it does not list general guides or tour businesses.
So your contribution to the article content remains and has been slightly edited, however your own business name has been removed as a supplier of tour guide providing access to those activities. The Guideline on this matter states; "Tours can be listed on Wikivoyage as long as they constitute a value-added activity. If a traveler could fulfill the substance of the tour on their own, the tour should not be listed" Please also have a look over these guidance articles; Welcome, business owners, Tour listings, and MoS.

In regard to listing in the Guides and trekking agencies sub-section please outline your experience and provide some references, including; trekking experience, number of ascents, current equipment, and crew detail. Also please detail which trekking provider you worked with as a Porter, and how many ascents you have performed on your own as a stand-alone Guide, and the normal number of participants in the ascents you have provided as a Guide. Thanks-- Felix (talk) 05:53, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Hello Felix!

Thanks for your information.

It's not true that other providers also have a day trip in Senaru and Bayan in their program. They only offer a half day program with a panorama walk, they visit the traditional village and the waterfalls. Nobody brings his guests also to Bayan or Ancak. So I changed this part in Other activities again.

Andreas has a lot of experience. He started to be a porter in 2000, two years later he got a guide. He climbed Rinjani so often with guests, that he can not count it anymore. In this years he was working for many different providers in Senaru. Last year he started his own business and is organizing trips now. He knows many guides and porters, has seen many times how they are working, and asked the best ones to work for him. He is using good equipment: new tents, good sleeping bags from Austria and big sleeping mats.

All of the guests he had until now, have been very satisfied. He offers a very good service and shows and tells our guests a lot about local life. They also get real traditional local food on our trips. For his team he creates good working conditions. His guides and porters get good food on the trips and he gives them a good and fair salary.

So everything what I was writing was true. I don't really understand, why Andreas' expedition is not listed anymore on this page. I thought wikivoyage wants to be up to date. So if there is a new organizer, why do you not want to see him in the provider list? And does every provider has to discuss first his experience before he is listed?

By the way, how many times have you already been on Rinjani and with which organizer did you make the trip/trips? Or what connection do you have to the providers listed here on wikivoyage?

We are already looking forward to hear about your experience. Best wishes, Sandra —The preceding comment was added by DewiSandra (talk • contribs)

Hi Sandra, perhaps you need to look over Tour listings again and you will understand the issues concerning the activities listings in this article. Your comment that; "Nobody brings his guests also to Bayan or Ancak" is somewhat subjective, other providers have a day trips to Senaru and Bayan. Lombok has many day tour providers with varying programs. However in the Wikivoyage article context it comes down to this guideline; "Tours can be listed on Wikivoyage as long as they constitute a value-added activity. If a traveler could fulfill the substance of the tour on their own, the tour should not be listed".
So what this means is tours such as that are not going to be listed anyway. You are however welcome to describe them in the article prose, and that is how they are presented now in the article. It was not appropriate to list them as an activity provided by your business as a separate activity listing. That is why the business details were previously removed from that section of the article.

In relation to the mountain ascents. You are outlining above that Andreas first worked as a guide 11 years ago, and as a porter for two years prior to that. You also mention that he has been organising trips for under one year. This article has no need to list every provider on the mountain or every entity announcing themselves as a new trek provider or organizer. If you are familiar with the Rinjani situation you will no doubt be aware there is a sizable number of entities already asserting they do that. Andreas is only one of many. You would also be aware that a trekking organiser with under one year of experience is really somewhat short on experience as a trek organiser. The mountain has a generous number of individuals and entities claiming to be 'expert' providers. You need to provide some supporting information as per the requested detail above. There are adequate established and suitably experience providers currently listed in a number sufficient to provide a starting point for travellers to make enquiries about the destination. There is no need for the article to list every provider who enters the field. It should be understood these travel guide articles do not seek to provide a service directory for a destination.

It was also inappropriate for you to just re-list again when the listing had been removed. So that listing is going to be removed again whilst this matter is looked into in some more depth. That does not indicate that Andreas will not be listed in the future. However it would assist if the information requested above was to be provided, and in less than vague terms. So please do provide some more information in that regard. Thanks -- Felix (talk) 18:48, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Hi Felix, I was reading the article about tour listings and understand that it's not allowed to list our day trip. And I have seen that you only left 6 trekking providers in the list, 2 of them are from Senaru and a third one has an office in Senaru. How comes that many 'expert' providers like Galang Ijo or Rudy Trekker are missing, while for example Rinjani Adventure is on the list, which is in Sinar Rinjani (not anymore Sinar Selatan)? Who is deciding here which provider is listed? Are you a Rinjani 'expert'? Can you tell us where it's written in the guidelines that only providers who are organising trips for many years are listed? And how many years experience does an 'expert' need? We already asked you who you are and what connection you have to Rinjani, and are still waiting for your answer. It's also inappropriate of you to delete our post. 13 years hiking experience should be enough to be listed here. Thanks too —The preceding comment was added by DewiSandra (talk • contribs)

The listings for trekking providers should be kept to a list of established providers with a depth of experience in organizing ascents. Normally the articles do not list tours, guides or trekking providers at all. The reason they are listed in this article is determined by both the formal park requirement for a guide, and also the sometimes hazardous nature of the trekking ascents and mountain slopes.

There is no need for every provider, booking service or new entrant to be listed in the article, especially if they have only been operating for a few months and have limited experience as a trekking organizer. The articles are not intended as a service directory, or as an advertising channel.

Green Rinjani was only originally listed in the context of their tourism focussed tree planting programs, they have now ceased that activity, so that provider has been removed. Their listing was not as a mountain ascent provider, it was for walks on the slopes that included a tree planting program. -- Felix (talk) 18:33, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your information.

We started organising Rinjani treks last year in April and had in 2012 15 groups (1 - 4 persons). Since the nationalpark opened this year, we had 4 groups. So what do you think, how many years do we have to organise treks until we can be listed here on wiki too?

We also found this text in the goals and non-goals: "The wiki technique we use for Wikivoyage makes it possible for us to include information that's not in other travel guides. This doesn't mean that we only include information not found in other guides. Wikivoyage aims to be a complete travel guide – not just a supplement to traditional guides." So it should also be possible to list a new office, or not?

We also offer something special. Our office could be listed in the context of our eco-friendly tourism focussed on showing our guests how real life on Lombok is and offering real traditional local food.

If we understand you right, you have the qualification for deciding which provider is listed here. Are you the manager of this page? -- User:DewiSandra - —The preceding comment was added by DewiSandra (talk • contribs)

Please Sandra, just read the detail provided above, and have a look through both the article history, and the Wikivoyage contribution guidelines. Perhaps also consider if the completion of part of one season is representing a depth of experience organising mountain ascents.

The article already has sufficient information to inform a traveller. The article does not seek to provide a comprehensive listing of all providers on the mountain, more so it seeks to provide a brief list of suitably proficient and experienced trekking providers with sufficient depth of experience organising ascents that the reader may be informed concerning the destination, and be able to locate at least a basic choice of reputable and qualified providers at that destination.

If you feel very strongly that there is someone on that list that should not be there then by all means make a case for them to be removed. No clear benefit can be readily identified in adding further trek organisers to that list. Are you perhaps suggesting the other providers are in some manner not living a "real" life, the other participants conducting trekking ascents on the mountain no doubt hold the view they are quite "real" as well.

Other operators are similarly providing ascents whilst promoting a 'environmentally responsible' outlook, other organisers are also including meals in their packages. If you consider the meals provided on your ascents are more delicious than those of others, or more authentic to the mountain's slopes then that is something you could perhaps promote in your marketing. If you are seeking to improve the standard of food on the ascents then that is a positive development and should assist you to develop your business and market share. -- Felix (talk) 18:10, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Note: There have been repeated instances of new listings being posted here. Don't do that. This is the talk page. All new listings posted here long after the 2013 discussion have been reverted (deleted), and if you post yet another new listing here, it, too, will be reverted. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:57, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

The article has "Rinjani Park regulations stipulate the use of a certified guide..." Is there perhaps a government site with a list? Pashley (talk) 12:49, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

OtBP?

This article seems to pop up every now and then in Recent Changes, unfortunately mostly due to touts. The article has guide status and could at least theoretically be nominated for OtBP. BUT with so much touting going on, and due to the fact that many sections look quite brief, I firstly would like to ask people more familiar with the region if there's anything fishy about this article so that possible problems can be fixed right away before Mt Rinjani is nominated.

Who may know something about the place? Ikan? Felix505?

If the dry season is from April to November perhaps we should aim for April 2016 (or March if you need to book trekking guides a couple of weeks ahead)? Later it will have to compete with the already nominated European and North American articles. ϒpsilon (talk) 10:34, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Anyone? ϒpsilon (talk) 14:52, 4 August 2015 (UTC)

I've dealt with so much touting in this article that I've been hesitant to say anything. If you'd like to nominate it, go ahead. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:26, 4 August 2015 (UTC)

If you are a healthy person (stamina for at least 3 days), you can climb Mount Rinjani through hard way or more easy way, but need more time. Don't worry about trekking guide, there are always available and can be prepared on the spot instantly. Sorry, I cannot say anything about nomination, due to I haven't yet read the other nomination candidates.Gsarwa (talk) 06:46, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

Copyvio? No, the original is ours

To fix the issues that are necessary for the article to become OtBP, I was searching for information on the hot springs and such that have very brief descriptions. Now I ran into this site and to my horror I notice that there are several parts that are verbatim to our Mount Rinjani guide (sight descriptions, "Most of the visitors come to Mount Rinjani through Senaru village...", "Mount Rinjani is the best climbed during the dry season (April-November)..."). As the article has been a target for touting, I thought the content was copied over by a tout (or someone else).

But that site apparently dates from 9 October 2014...and the content was in our article already in September see here. So it's they who are the copyright violators. As you can see, Wikivoyage is not credited anywhere (nor is WT). BTW, I suspect the reason for some of the sentences in our article being different from the one on the tour agency's (?) is that Ikan or someone else has copyedited text that was originally written by a non-native English speaker. Should we do something? ϒpsilon (talk) 14:30, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Ady Adventure (potential spam)

An anonymous editor has today replaced a listing with another listing. I have no idea whether the new listing is valid or not, but I checked out the link to the old one and it is still working with no indication that it has been taken over or closed down. Furthermore the new listing seems to be a different one, as all its details (number,address etc) are different, so it seems to me like someone tried to delete a listing of a competitor. I reverted the edit, but the same anonymous editor made the same edit again. I don't want to start an edit war here, so I want to put this up for discussion. Is there a valid reason for this listing to be replaced or is this just spam? Drat70 (talk) 05:19, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected

Given three attempts to add a tour listing I have semi-protected this for a day. I hope that this is not considered too draconian. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 09:45, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Actually, looking closer at the article's history I noticed this tout has tried to add his businesses since more than a week... ϒpsilon (talk) 09:49, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

I already blacklisted his URL, and I blocked this iteration of his persona for a day, but he previously used dynamic IPs. Very annoying. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:50, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

And now 3 days for block evasion. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:52, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Reinstated semi-protection for 1 week. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 04:17, 7 June 2016 (UTC)

This article is getting a disproportionate amount of touting for over a year now. Shall we just make it long term semi-protected? --Andrewssi2 (talk) 00:36, 10 April 2017 (UTC)

I'd support that. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:51, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Odd description

What is this:

• Full Rinjani, [...] Offers a Rinjani trekking package. They tout their team as experienced, professional, ...

It sounds like a warning, but then they should not be in a listing. Vandalism? --LPfi (talk) 09:06, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

I notice similar wording about Lhuna Adventure. Tired of touts? --LPfi (talk) 09:10, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Yes indeed. Not vandalism; self-listing plus edits by me. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:13, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Too much detail?

Mount_Rinjani#History currently has three paragraphs for eruptions in 2009 & 2010. I'd cut that to one sentence, or at most two.

Other opinions? Pashley (talk) 03:42, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

Good idea. Ground Zero (talk) 09:05, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

Agreed. Sometimes there's joy in detailed history; this is not one of those times.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 09:09, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

Done. I ended up with a single paragraph. Pashley (talk) 10:25, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

I cut it down to one sentence now, including the 2015 one. Should some of it be put back in some form? –LPfi (talk) 14:18, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

Who writes all this stuff?

Notwithstanding that it's a very comprehensive guide, but who wrote all this, I wonder? It's like a 100-page composition practically. Evidently, the person must have been very knowledgable on the topic. Or was everything just collected from wikitravel (wherever that material came from)? Lazarus1255 (talk) 06:48, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Since you're interested to know, look through the article's history. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:56, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

And on WT: There was a fork, so everything was brought over, including most authors still active at that time. –LPfi (talk) 09:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The article has grown from some 26 kB to some 33 kB since the fork, see the diff. –LPfi (talk) 09:19, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Oh okay, thanks. I was just impressed by the volume (and quality, too). There must be some very adroit travelers out there. I wish I had more experience under my belt. Lazarus1255 (talk) 16:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Touty links

The following all offer organised treks with accommodation, transport to the mountain, return to your accommodation and can also help with hiring a private guide if required:

• Rinjani Samalas Tour & TrekkingMount Rinjani hiking Tour guide from Senaru village. tel:+6282341446551 mailto:rinjanisamalas@gmail.com
• Dedy Adventure, sembalun village,East Lombok-Indonesia, ☏ +62340876767, info@rinjanitrip.com. Offer Rinjani Trekking package for beginner climbers and experienced climbers.headed by Dedy,Trekking organizer based in sembalun village. Experienced Rinjani trekking guide since 2008. 
• Mr. Adi Rinjani, Senaru, Lombok, ☏ +62 852-3806-6401, mradirinjani@gmail.com. Adi is a guide himself and will help you organize and book your trip to Mount Rinjani. Besides all kinds of tracking packages, also transport and accommodation can be arranged. Treks can be booked as private tours or within a public but small group. Prices for 2019 can be seen on the website. Upon request, you will get a reply within 24 hours. (updated Jul 2019)
• Dhyns Rinjani Hiking, Jalan Pariwisata Senaru, bayan, Nusa Tenggara Barat, ☏ +62 81238076623, dhynsrinjani@gmail.com. Offering tour packages to Mount Rinjani, from 2 days to 5 days program, with a great services and reasonable prices, and professional guide and porters. 
• Full Rinjani, Jl Pariwiasta Senaru, Bayan, ☏ +62 87864356690, full123expedition@gmail.com. Offers a Rinjani trekking package. They tout their team as experienced, professional, friendly and caring about the environment and provide high-quality camping equipment (tents, sleeping bags, mattresses, pillows, camping chairs and a toilet tent) and tasty food. 
• Hajar Trekking, Dusun Tumpang Sari Desa Senaru, Bayan, ☏ +62 81916014731, info@rinjanitrekkingplanner.com. Local trekking company in Senaru village concerning with an affordable trekking tour package service. 
• Herman Trekker, Jalan Pariwisata, Senaru, ☏ +6281918429666, hermantrekkerrinjani@gmail.com. Headed by Herman, who used to work as a barman and is familiar with western culture and accommodation. Team of experienced guides for Mt. Rinjani. The team speaks good English and is polite and accommodating. Herman has a high respect for the environment and practices sustainable trekking activities. (updated Jun 2015)
• John’s Adventures, Jl Senaru, Senaru, ☏ +62 817 5788018, rinjani_master@yahoo.com. Established agency with full range of trekking packages. John has been guiding climbers and arranging treks up Rinjani for over 20 years. Comfortable base at Senaru with a cafe, pickups are available from hotels and the airport. 
• Jou Trekking, Jl Pariwiasta senaru, Bayan, ☏ +6285338627708, joutrekking@gmail.com. Provides packages to mount Rinjani. Guide & porters and good quality of trekking equipment. 
• Evsi Rinjani, Jl Pariwiasta, Senaru village, ☏ +6281915987599, infotrekrinjani@gmail.com. Provides trekking packages to Mount Rinjani can be sharing package (join group) and private trek tour by sembalun gate or senaru gate trekking start. 
• Lhuna Adventure, Jln Pariwiasta Senaru Bayan, info.adventure25@gmail.com. Rinjani trekking team (trekking guide and great trekking porter). Touts its "great service" during the trek, transport and hotel. 
• Lombok Rinjani Trek Organisation, Hotel Lombok Raya, Mataram, ☏ +62 370 641124, +62 813 53443445. Official partnership between the national park authority and local communities with support from NZ AID. Full range of trekking packages. City office in Mataram and one at each of the two trek departure points. 
• Rinjani Footprint, Jl Wisata Alam Kerandangan, ☏ +62 813 5344 3445 (hotline), rinjani.fp@gmail.com. Professionally run expeditions under the management of an experienced operator. All trek teams work to prescribed standards including; direct first hand experience at the destination, respect for the environment, social and cultural sensitivities.). 
• Rinjani Fun Trekking, Jl Pariwiasta, Senaru village, ☏ +6281999195335, rinjanifun@gmail.com. Reliable Mount Rinjani trekking organizer established by experienced local guides. 
• Rinjani Trekking Club, Jl. Raya Senggigi Km 08, Senggigi, ☏ +62 370 693202, fax: +62 370 693202, rinjaniclub@gmail.com. 24hr. Responsible, knowledgeable and run by Ronie, the wel - established RTC is the best of the many outfits along senggigi's main strip howking Rinjani Treks. There is wide choice of guided hikes available; all include entrance fees, three meals a day, camping equipment. whatsApp +628175730415 
• Trekking Mount Rinjani Organizer, Jalan cendrawasih No 8 Cakranegara, Nusa Tenggara Barat, ☏ +62 817 369010, info@trekkingrinjani.com. Tour packages offering the ascent of Mount Rinjani, 2 days 1 night, 3 days 2 nights, 4 days 3 nights, 5 days 4 nights and 6 days 5 nights. 

Ibaman, the problem is, a guide is required to climb this mountain. A cautionbox says "It is recommended to either use one of the providers listed in this article or to make arrangements directly with a provider after arriving in Lombok." However, no provider is listed now except for one providing transportation to Senaru or Sembalun Lawang that's still listed in "Get in," probably because you missed it. It's hard to police which listings are reliable, but having no listings is untenable, so I think we have to restore listings that do not have touty language. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:36, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

yeah, I see, and raise no objections... this is very unpleasant, to have such a huge spamlist in this page. Ibaman (talk) 17:58, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Ibaman, do you want to try your hand at editing any of the listings? We should restore them soon because of travellers' need to have a guide. Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:18, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

I gave it a try. What a sadness, to need to have long lists like this. Ibaman (talk) 15:11, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

We could curate the list if we knew how. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:28, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Which is the official site?

Jayengrane changed the URL in the lead – which should be the park's official site – from rinjaninationalpark.com to rinjaninationalpark.id. The domain of the former (.com) and the "Recommended Trekking Operator...") seems to suggest it is a commercial site, but the footer says "Copyright @ Rinjani National Park". The latter also says "Taman Nasional Gunung Rinjani", but my language skills don't allow me to evaluate the site further.

Regardless, it seems that the sites don't reference each other and thus it doesn't seem they are both by the official administration. So which one is official? What is the other one?

(I think the history section should be cut down. Was the additional info from Wikipedia? We don't need to know that "On May 5th 2010 a possible ash plume rose to an altitude of 5.5 km (18,000 ft) and drifted 150 km NW" and similar detail. Please condense the info on 1994–2015.)

–LPfi (talk) 15:40, 25 April 2023 (UTC)