Talk:Bi'r Tawīl

How would one get this page to "usable

One has to wonder... Hobbitschuster (talk) 16:34, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

It has a dynamic map and a map mask, just waiting to show off all those potential listings. Should count for something? :) Andrewssi2 (talk) 10:11, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

The closest couple of cities that we have articles for could probably be added in the Get in section, as in where the nearest international airport is located and where you can stock up on provisions. Then some more points about dos and don'ts for a desert environment. Possibly there's information about landforms in Bir Tawil and the flora and fauna of eastern Sahara on some scientific website.

Actually, if we want to go real far, someone could get into contact with the guy who claimed the area a while ago as he apparently has been there in person and probably has documented the place to some extent. ϒpsilon (talk) 12:53, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

It would actually be better represented by a national park template... then it could get up to usable. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 21:19, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Perhaps. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:16, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

The Tire Tracks Aren't Rumors!

I went on Google Maps. You can follow the link and clearly see tire tracks (make sure you're in satellite mode). And notice that when you zoom in on the map where it says "Tire Tracks", a road is shown. SelfieCity (talk) 19:20, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Very well, but per External links, the attraction shouldn't be linked to Google Maps. Ibaman (talk) 19:31, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Okay, got it. SelfieCity (talk) 19:37, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

I appreciate that there are slim pickings to be had, but do tire tracks really qualify as attractions? Andrewssi2 (talk) 20:08, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Rescue time

An IP user added "be prepared to wait up to 76 hours for rescue". Are there systems in place to guarantee rescue in that time frame? In the Stay safe section we say you should not rely on any governmental help. So who will come to assist you? Ordinary villagers? How do you connect to them with your satellite phone? --LPfi (talk) 16:34, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

You can phone to all types of phones with a satellite phone. Otherwise such a phone makes no sense. But you are correct: there is no guarantee rescue only if you made a really good preparation before the trip. At least you need experienced local people like Bedouins who know that area and the security forces. --RolandUnger (talk) 16:58, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Yes. I mentioned satellite phone only because that is the only one that will work. And it is little use unless you can reach the right people (or have somebody else reach them). Are you going to hunt for their phone numbers when the emergency is a fait accompli? If you make good preparations there is no 76 hours waiting time: you might have those Bedouins waiting somewhere in reach or you can have a helicopter ready to take off. And if there comes a sandstorm that lasts three days, you will have to wait more than 76 hours anyway (I do not know how long storms typically last here, but I guess it is possible). So I am declined to think that the "76 hours" figure is pulled from thin air, but I'll wait for some more discussion. --LPfi (talk) 17:38, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

"One of only two places..."

The article starts with the line:

Bi'r Tawīl is one of only two places outside Antarctica that is officially Terra Nullius...

And where is the other? Liberland? If so, shouldn't we clarify by explicitly naming it somewhere in the article (perhaps as a "Go next" destination)? @SHB2000: it seems you edited the said sentence to its current form; any ideas? Vidimian (talk) 13:27, 27 October 2022 (UTC)

Yes, the other place is indeed Liberland. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 20:32, 27 October 2022 (UTC)

I added it with an explainer to "Go next", in order not to break the flow in the intro. Vidimian (talk) 10:33, 28 October 2022 (UTC)

Breadcrumbing

Wouldn't it make more sense for Bir Tawil to be breadcrumbed to North Africa with the article linked in North Africa#Other territories per Wikivoyage:Be fair#Political disputes? --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 08:07, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Well, on the one hand it feels weird and wrong to breadcrumb a no man's land to a legally-defined country (moreover to a region named "... Coast" when it's not even close to the coast), but on the other, there are practical issues, like Sealand (when it existed as an article) being very much of an afterthought in updating breadcrumbs whenever the name for the continental region containing it got changed, quite a frequent occurrence back then, breaking its breadcrumb trail for periods of time (I thought breadcrumbing it to the nearest English region would keep it in sync when/if the name for that archipelagic region gets changed again). I don't expect the name or scope of the North Africa region changing any time soon, but still I am not sure. Vidimian (talk) 08:49, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

And to be brutally correct, we can't breadcrumb this to North Africa, because this is a dispute (or rather non-dispute) between Egypt and Sudan, which don't share the same continental region. But then Africa is far too large of a geography to contain this, IMO. Vidimian (talk) 09:01, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

On second (or third) thought, Sudan seems to be okay with leaving this area to Egypt (even if Egypt doesn't seem to care a bit), so the current set-up is unlikely to arouse any issues regarding politics. But perhaps Upper Egypt is a better region to breadcrumb this to. Vidimian (talk) 09:06, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

The thing is, breadcrumbing this article under Egypt (or a region categorised underneath Egypt) would be taking Sudan's side in this political dispute, which is why I don't think it's a wise idea per Wikivoyage:Be fair#Political disputes. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 09:51, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Hmm, you're right, I didn't think of that before.

This area might be the only one of its kind at this website, with no claimant or administration at all (not even a micronation) and no clear approach into it. So I guess I'm fine with breadcrumbing it to North Africa, mentioning it in North Africa#Other territories, as well as in the relevant sections of the adjacent Egyptian and Sudanese regions. Vidimian (talk) 10:12, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Campground

On Google earth it appears there’s a campground should we mention this? Radon difluoride (talk) 20:24, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

Places where our readers (except those going there by employment) cannot sleep should not be listed in Sleep. I assume this campground is for employees of some mining (or military) firm. However, we should add something on people you might meet in Understand, if we know anything about it. –LPfi (talk) 12:18, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

There seem to be a bunch of actual buildings at and around 21.8323N 33.8093E (Google marks them as a "Campground"). That might be an area you'd want to avoid – or walk towards when your vehicle gets stuck ... El Grafo (talk) 16:41, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

 :-)

True. But don't put it as campground under Sleep. Are there other places with similar activity? It would be nice to know what they are about, to describe the marker sensibly.

–LPfi (talk) 13:28, 14 November 2023 (UTC)

To me it looks like a village rather than a campground, but who knows. Google Maps markers are often wrong in out-of-the-way places like this. I think we need some more definitive information to be able to say anything useful about this in the article. —Granger (talk · contribs) 14:37, 14 November 2023 (UTC)