Talk:Montreal

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Archive[edit]

Archived some older discussion at Talk:Montreal/Archives. --(WT-en) Dawnview 00:58, 23 September 2006 (EDT)

Added to archives --- (WT-en) Maj 11:15, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

Style[edit]

For consistency sake, I'd like to suggest standardizing the language used for place names to "French (English translation if needed)" For example "Vieux Ville (Old Town)" and so on. Probably don't need to do it for obvious cases like "Centre Bell (Bell Centre)." (WT-en) Maj 11:18, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

Sources[edit]

some good references (WT-en) Maj 17:19, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

Vandalism[edit]

Can someone revert changes to this article please? I would do them individually but there are quite a few so I thought it would be easier for an Admin to just revert. Thanks --(WT-en) Matt Talk 22:36, 24 August 2008 (EDT)

That doesn't require an admin; on the page history, you can select multiple revisions to view, and then "undo" them all at once. (WT-en) LtPowers 08:35, 25 August 2008 (EDT)
Yes, I realized this after someone reverted the changes. Thank you for the info though...I will do it myself in the future. --(WT-en) Matt Talk 11:30, 25 August 2008 (EDT)

Guide status[edit]

hmmmm, is there any compelling reasons why this city it not a guide? (WT-en) Sertmann 20:32, 5 September 2008 (EDT)

Yes, 5 outline districts & 2 uncreated ones. Per Project:City guide status, all districts must be at least usable for the city to be called a guide. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 21:02, 5 September 2008 (EDT)
Why? Those are seperate articles and the Montréal one is very good! COuld use sonme more, but very good, I think it's a guide. Definately! Maybe someone should fill in those districts, thoough. Keep smiling - (WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 13:16, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast

::Sugestiion¡[edit]

Hi, Montréalers, Montréal-lovers, and Montréal travellers. I was wondering if someone felt like to make a map of the districts for MTL? I was just wondering because I think it's needed. Saddly, I cannot because I don't know mucbh about Montréal, although the city is pretty:). I'm not forcing you just asking. Waht do you think? Maybe look at Chicago or New York for inspiration.  :)

Keep smilin',

(WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 13:15, 23 October 2008 (EDT)Edmontonenthusiast

montréal[edit]

Why is this article called MONTREAL? It is spelled incorrectly, it's Montréal! I just don't get it. Just because Canada is English speaking doesn't mean we shouldn't recognize it's French part. To me it is just weird. It sounds incorrect. I know it's easier for people not to remember Alt + 0233 = é on English computers, or to go into Word and click the symbol but still. I just think it's stupid. At least have Montreal as a redirect page, and then Montréal as the page itself. That ways you both win! Am I just out of my mind? Keep smiling, (WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 14:25, 1 November 2008 (EDT)

We're the English version of Wikivoyage, and Montreal is the official English name of the city. French version is over here, and they do spell it in proper French ;o) (WT-en) Sertmann 14:30, 1 November 2008 (EDT)
So I'm paranoid.Got it. (although other cities have accents in their name...) keep smiling, (WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 14:33, 1 November 2008 (EDT)
You are not referring to Seyðisfjörður are you? ;o) seriously though, we should use the English names whenever possible, I don't run around insisting we rename Copenhagen to København, or Cologne to Köln - But there are probably loads of cities that doesn't have an English name, where it's possible to use accents - just remember Montreal is a bi-lingual city. (WT-en) Sertmann 14:39, 1 November 2008 (EDT)
i know montréal is a biligual city etc etc. but french is the main language, once english, now french (like when montréal was canada's largest city although in quebec english was it's main language)..anyways, it's just one accent and barely changes it and thats why i think it'd be simply easy. but again, stupid idea;). keep smiling ,(WT-en) Edmontonenthusiast 14:41, 1 November 2008 (EDT)
Note: many peoples are speeking english in Montreal but officially it is not a bilingual city. Official language is not French and English but only French.

Amtrak[edit]

did the president of Amtrak write this entry? I have been shuttling back and forth between New York and Montreal for years and I have never met any one who has taken that train more than once! It can take up to 14hours! It is absolute hell and takes almost twice as long as greyhound. —The preceding comment was added by 24.90.118.151 (talkcontribs) .

Parking[edit]

It would be nice if there was information on good free parking places. I would love to come to Montreal, park near a metro station and not have to worry about driving in town. 72.228.85.246

Re-added link to Coach Canada sale fare website[edit]

Hi. I re-added a second link to the Coach Canada entry in the "Get in by bus" section after someone removed it. It now looks like this: "Coach Canada (regular fares: [1]; sale fares to certain cities only: [2])". I am not affiliated with Coach Canada, nor do I make any money or benefit from promoting them. I put the link there because I found out about it from poster ads they put in Toronto, and from www.redflagdeals.com. It is a link to cheaper fares from Toronto. If you have any questions, please reply below and email me at unforgettableid at gmail.com to let me know to look at this talk page, since I check it rarely. Cheers, (WT-en) Unforgettableid 11:45, 5 July 2009 (EDT)

Kosher[edit]

I removed the huge kosher restaurant listing. I dont think any listings of kosher / halal / montinac / macrobiotic / mormon church approved / catholic or any other sect who think they must distinct themselves from peasants by eatin/drinking/doing/forbidding things do not belong in wikivoyage. Of course they have their right to exist, but i suggest they create their own sites for such purposes. —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 24.201.116.160 (talkcontribs)

Such information is relevant to many travelers and certainly does not merit deletion. If it's not of interest to you, don't read it. If you wish to delete it, obtain consensus first; in the meantime, I've restored it. - (WT-en) Dguillaime 17:13, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
Yes i can do that, the just dont read it part, no problem, but if all these groups start to add their content in these quantities, usefull information will soon not be found anymore and we will be better of with google.

—The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 24.201.116.160 (talkcontribs)

Oh and by the way, i think these lists with restaurants should go - if anywhere - in the quartiers like the rest.

—The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 24.201.116.160 (talkcontribs)

The list is too long, in the wrong place (should be in districts), and very Yellow Pages like. --(WT-en) inas 18:59, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
Same with the ice cream section, for that matter. I'll tack on a {{districtify}} box at the top of that section, and we can see about moving them to their proper homes -- just seems unnecessary to wipe it completely, rather than making use of the (perhaps misplaced) information already there. - (WT-en) Dguillaime 19:33, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
I also think that it should be removed. Most other cities don't have that kind of information and I don't think religiously approved food is something relevant on that kind of general web-site. If you add one, add them all... or add none (If it was something not affiliated with religion, like vegetarian restaurants, I think it would be ok).(WT-en) Roli 19:09, 2 November 2009 (EST)
I agree. Create a new page Montreal/Kosher restaurant and put only the link here. I'm a hosteler and I never get jude customer so they never request me that kind of thing and the majority of Jude are now atheists so... they don't eat Kosher any more and they don't want to finance a terrorist government too! —The preceding comment was added by 24.201.41.167 (talkcontribs)

There is no policy rationale to simply delete these listings for keeping kosher. They should, however, be moved out of the existing section to the eat sections of individual district articles, as Dguillaime said above. --(WT-en) Peter Talk 20:55, 3 March 2010 (EST)

Francophones[edit]

Re: this edit, I would think that "second-largest French-speaking city" refers to the actual number of Francophones living there, doesn't it? Based on Democratic Republic of the Congo#Talk, my guess is that only a minority of people in Kinshasa speaks French. (WT-en) LtPowers 09:17, 12 December 2009 (EST)


Sleep[edit]

Why in english there is no best deal sleep address for backpackers? Who is vandalizing all the information that I put twice? —The preceding comment was added by (WT-en) 24.201.41.167 (talkcontribs)

Read Apt and Project:Don't tout to understand whether your apartment listing is appropriate for this site or not. In addition, no one is "vandalizing" your listing - the reason that there are no individual businesses listed in the "Sleep" section for this article is because (as the section explains) travelers should look to the articles about the districts of Montreal for individual listings. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 12:52, 28 February 2010 (EST)

Contradiction[edit]

On the one hand this article says that motorists are generally respectful of pedestrians, further down it says that pedestrians should exercise care as motorists are not respectful. So which is it? (WT-en) Ivandh 00:37, 16 April 2010 (EDT)

Montreal/Mile-End[edit]

Does the new page Montreal/Mile-End fit into the current district break-down? (WT-en) LtPowers 14:07, 12 August 2010 (EDT)

Districts[edit]

So let me get this straight... a city of just 1.6 million people divided into 22 district articles, 11 of which go to cover only Ville-Marie borough, and the other 11 to cover all the other 31 boroughs? Is that what I'm seeing here?? (WT-en) texugo 08:05, 18 August 2011 (EDT)

Yep. I was wondering about exactly the same thing yesterday. --(WT-en) globe-trotter 10:52, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
This is in Quebec, we have to do everything our own way. Maybe we need to start with the boroughs then break it down from there? Start with the map on the page, use that as the guide, then list the seperate cities and their attractions OR just use the conventional names for the various areas in the city i.e. Mile, Latin Quater, Old Montreal etc. and use the official names for the absolute information like an address or a metro station. --(WT-en) Redbear 16:06, 18 November 2011 (EST)
I think the conventional names should definitely be used for areas in the city centre. The outer boroughs should be merged together somehow to make sensible districts for travelers. --(WT-en) Globe-trotter 18:27, 18 November 2011 (EST)
Here is something I put together very quickly, a new Districts section without all the divisions User:(WT-en) Redbear/Sandbox Scroll all the way down to see what I've done. The other cities section needs work with the various attractions added to the correct pages. --(WT-en) Redbear 23:59, 18 November 2011 (EST)

Speaking of districts, Verdun/Ile-des-Soeurs is not represented in a district article. Should I make a new separate district article, or just merge it with the Sud-Ouest article, which is geographically the closest? (WT-en) Dextery 01:18, 31 December 2011 (EST)

I would just merge it with Sud-Ouest for the time being, since that article is still fairly small. It can always be split later if it becomes too big. (WT-en) Eco84 09:32, 31 December 2011 (EST)

Districts anyone?[edit]

By chance I spotted the district tag, and I can see that the district discussion has come to a standstill two years ago. Is it something here in the article that needs to be done about them or is the tag obsolete? AFAIU there are quite a few active Wikivoyagers living within a couple hundred km from the city who might have some knowledge of Montreal. ϒpsilon (talk) 22:05, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

User:K7L, User:AndreCarrotflower, User:Pashley, User:Eco84 someone else maybe? (Disclaimer: I can unfortunately not really help as I've never been to Montreal or anywhere else in Canada) ϒpsilon (talk) 22:30, 11 January 2014 (UTC)
To Ypsilon: I have some thoughts, but it's been so crazy at work that I haven't had time to compose them properly. Give me a few hours and I'll weigh in. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 01:53, 12 January 2014 (UTC)
I do not really know Montreal. I'm from Ottawa which is 200 km away but I have not spent any significant time in Montreal in decades. Pashley (talk) 06:27, 12 January 2014 (UTC)
The city article is districtified, but perhaps there is something wrong with the district division? Someone familiar with Montreal could take a look and if nothing is remarkably wrong with it, it's probably safe to remove the district tag. ϒpsilon (talk) 10:34, 12 January 2014 (UTC)

To Ypsilon: Sorry this took me so long. In my opinion, I agree with (WT-en) Redbear's contention that we should follow the city government's official arrondissement boundaries, as the arrondissement names are heavily used in waymarking signs, official tourist literature, etc.

However, all of Montreal's arrondissements are not of equal interest to tourists, so we should feel free to lump together more off-the-beaten-path arrondissements (for example, I probably wouldn't mess with the current boundaries of the multiple-arrondissement districts Montreal/West Island or Montreal/North Island too much) or subdivide heavily-touristed ones like Ville-Marie and Le Plateau-Mont-Royal (the end result for those districts would likely resemble Chicago's districting scheme in which the "list of nine" don't have articles of their own, but each item is followed by a parenthetical list of smaller districts that do). Middle-of-the-road arrondissements like Mercier-Hochelaga-Maisonneuve or Rosemont-La Petite-Patrie might indeed coincide with the district articles.

As well, I would treat the several independent cities that are enclaves of Montreal (such as Westmount) as districts of the city, or parts of districts, for the purposes of our coverage (c.f. Detroit/Hamtramck-Highland Park).

Hope this helps.

-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 05:40, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

Two more years have passed, nothing has happened... So...? Hobbitschuster (talk) 00:12, 24 March 2016 (UTC)
Okay, since no one else seems to want to bite on this, I will. Keep in mind that it's been a number of years since I've been to Montreal, so I'm a bit rusty. Nonetheless, here's my proposal for a simplified districts breakdown.
-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:39, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
Pinging Hobbitschuster re: the above. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:41, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
I don't know the city, but your idea sounds good to me. I just thought the current state of a discussion that went silent years ago was anything bu desirable... Hobbitschuster (talk) 21:52, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
Perhaps I should comment as it was me who tried to open the discussion in 2013 when trying to clean up cities that are halfway districtified or lacking maps. I've never been to Montreal either, but it's good that we at least have someone onboard who has. André's suggestion would divide the city into 7 districts (which is optimal per 7 2) so I think we should go for that. However let's wait for a week or so before implementing any major changes, to give other people a chance to comment. ϒpsilon (talk) 22:12, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
ϒpsilon - you're mistaken; my schematic calls for 11 districts. There are indeed seven bullet points in my list, but look closely at the second-last of those. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 23:11, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
Parenthetically, as regards my earlier comments about not knowing what district Parc Mont-Royal is supposed to be part of: it looks like it's currently covered in Montreal/Downtown, which is incorrect at any rate. I've slightly edited the text of my proposal above to reflect that. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 23:35, 25 March 2016 (UTC)
Ah, yes, now I see ;). I guess 11 districts are OK, if there are enough listings in each of them to make them usable (so that Montreal eventually could be promoted to Guide). --ϒpsilon (talk) 08:44, 26 March 2016 (UTC)

(reindent) I'd like to begin moving toward implementing this scheme, but I'd really prefer there to be some input from someone else who's perhaps more familiar with the city. Might Amqui or perhaps K7L have some insight they'd like to share? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 13:28, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Paging User:EvanProdromou. Pashley (talk) 23:08, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
I am not from Montreal and I have no opinion on this matters. Sorry, Amqui (talk) 18:00, 28 August 2017 (UTC)

Districts again[edit]

So in light of these edits - where are we now? Hobbitschuster (talk) 18:48, 23 May 2016 (UTC)

I don't think those edits reflect anything in particular vis-à-vis this discussion (in fact, I'd wager the user that made them isn't even aware this discussion exists). This seems to be nothing more than a routine mos edit, where the information that was already contained in Montreal#Regions was simply plugged into the appropriate template. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 19:41, 23 May 2016 (UTC)
I should say, though, that I'm very frustrated at the continued lack of participation in this discussion, even after pretty much everyone who might possibly have any knowledge of Montreal was pinged. I'm not confident enough that the breakdown I came up with is the best solution for the traveller, and even if I were, this is a bigger project than I'm willing to tackle singlehandedly. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 19:44, 23 May 2016 (UTC)
Unfortunately long stagnant region or district discussions are not limited to Montreal... And no, I don't know how to fix that, either... Hobbitschuster (talk) 19:49, 23 May 2016 (UTC)
w:Wikipedia:WikiProject Montreal? Powers (talk) 01:06, 24 May 2016 (UTC)

Wikimania[edit]

Should we try and come up with some sort of resolution ahead of Wikimania or should we try and get input from the participants then and leave it open until then? Hobbitschuster (talk) 13:19, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

No reason to wait on the off chance that it may become an issue again, as these discussions can always be reopened, in any case. Ikan Kekek (talk) 16:09, 5 January 2017 (UTC)
Well the discussion has not so much reached a conclusion as fallen asleep... Maybe we should ping the people most involved above? Hobbitschuster (talk) 16:20, 5 January 2017 (UTC)
If it will help speed things along: after spending a weekend in Montreal this past September, I now feel confident enough about my own proposal for redistrictification that I'd be comfortable just going with that, if that's the direction others want to go. The main stumbling block for me was the proposed Montreal/Mount Royal district, but after spending some time in the neighborhoods ringing Parc Mont-Royal I'm comfortable grouping all of them together (even despite the language differences between the traditionally Anglophone-majority Westmount and the rest of the district — the contrast remains noticeable, but it seems far from the stark, polarized situation of decades past and given that most Montréalais are functionally bilingual anyway, the impact on the traveller is limited). -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 18:42, 5 January 2017 (UTC)
Sounds good. I will keep an eye on it and use your districts on de: then. Till then I will focus of the general information. Thanks -- DerFussi 10:57, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

warning[edit]

Why the hell was the warning thingy removed, it's extremely important that people are aware about the lawlessness during demonstrations in downtown. —The preceding comment was added by 173.179.30.120 (talkcontribs)

Biodome[edit]

On an image caption:

File:Montreal Biodome.jpg, The Biosphere, a geodesic sphere on the grounds of the 1967 World's Fair

This doesn't look correct... isn't Biodôme the old Vélodôme cycling arena from the 1976 Owelympics, located near the Big Owe (Olympic Stadium). "w:Montreal Biodome, Not to be confused with w:Montreal Biosphère" (per Wikipedia). The image is a redlink so I'm not sure which of these two it depicted, but these are two separate venues (one from 1967, the other from 1976). K7L (talk) 17:08, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

It's this one. LtPowers (talk) 18:32, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
Looks like the author uploaded it with the incorrect name "biodôme" and then changed the description to "biosphère" without changing the file name.[3] The building depicted looks to be the same place illustrated in WP's biosphère article, so I've substituted that image. K7L (talk) 18:46, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
I don't know if replacement was necessary; the file will likely be transferred eventually. LtPowers (talk) 21:31, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
I looked at both images and WP's appeared to be the better-quality of the pair so I used it. If you do keep the other image for transfer to commons:, the file should be renamed as "Biodome" as the name of the world fair site building is erroneous. K7L (talk) 21:35, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Page banner[edit]

Any plans to give this city a page banner like DC or London? This picture might work if it were cropped a bit: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Montreal_Twilight_Panorama_2006.jpg --WilliamTheaker (talk) 03:09, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

The long-term plan is to create a custom banner for every destination, so, yes! That image could definitely work. If you want to get in on the fun, the quickest free software to use is Gimp [4]. Just open up that image in Gimp, hit Shift+C for the crop tool, and then set the crop tool to a fixed aspect ratio of 2100:300 (in "tool options") and crop away. Then go to Image -> Scale image and scale the cropped image to 2100:300. Then export as a jpg, upload to Commons, and voila!
If that was too confusing, I'm going to try and write a quick tutorial at Wikivoyage:Banner Expedition, to make it easier for more people to help out. --Peter Talk 03:52, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Cleanup ideas[edit]

I just spend a weekend here, and definitely have some thoughts to share on the state of this article.

The districts are very confusing. The tiny map is of no use, because it doesn't show any streets, so even if I know where I am I can't figure out what district it is, nor vice versa. The fact that the map is only in French certainly doesn't help. And many quartiers are not really mentioned or indicated on the map or in the description.

There are no maps! There's no map of the subway (the French version of the page has one), nor the underground city, nor the city in general. The "basic map" that someone drew in MS Paint is laughably useless.

District articles are a mixed bag. A few are usable (Montreal/Old Montreal is pretty good, Montreal/Downtown is good except for a very empty Eat section), but others are very empty.

Overall, this city could use some cleaning up. I can contribute some for things that don't require intimate knowledge of the city, but that's about it. --Bigpeteb (talk) 14:41, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

The map of the metro system on the French Wikivoyage is already bilingual, why don't you add it to the article yourself? Amqui (talk) 18:36, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

"Third Largest Francophone City"[edit]

I have noticed that whenever Montréal is mentioned, it is either called the third-largest francophone city in the world (as on this page) or the second-largest in the world (French and English pages for Canada and Québec, and the French page for Montréal). By any measure this is inaccurate. According to the Wikipedia list of largest cities (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities), it is either the 4th or the 8th. Francophone cities with both a larger city population and urban or metropolitan population are: Kinshasa, Abidjan, and Paris. In addition, Douala, Yaoundé, Ouagadougou, and Brazzaville have a larger population than Montréal proper.

As I do not see the value of listing Montréal as the 4th or 8th largest francophone city in the world, I am removing this reference. --Djwhitten (talk) 14:03, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

Perhaps replacing it with an unranked fact (like "Montreal is one of the largest francophone cities in the world", or even "Montreal is the largest francophone city in the Americas") would be better? I'm not that fussed, however. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 14:11, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
I used "prominent global francophone city" in the Quebec region on the Canada page, that might fit in somewhere? --Djwhitten (talk) 14:56, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
Out of curiosity, what qualifies a city as Francophone? Wikipedia says Kinshasa, for example, uses French in high business and government but Lingala is the language spoken on the streets. Powers (talk) 01:19, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
I was wondering the same. However, Montreal is hardly a uniformly francophone city either, with about a quarter of the population native speakers of English. Though pretty much everywhere French is spoken outside of Europe (and even within parts of Europe), there is at least one reasonably dominant additional local language. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 10:22, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
I think a lot of the Anglophones in Montreal are bilingual, though (as are a lot of the Francophones). Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:55, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
I just wanted to check the "Talk" section of Kinshasa. Unfortunately, such a section does not exist. An oversight, if you ask me. Hobbitschuster (talk) 12:14, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
I assume that if French is the lingua franca or official language of a city, it should be considered francophone. For example, in the Democratic Republic of the Congo Talk section it says that French is the lingua franca of the country and that "In Kinshasa and much of the Western DRC, nearly everyone is fluent in French." Similarly, in the Côte d'Ivoire Talk page it mentions that "The official language is French, which is widely spoken and main language of most urban areas." While all cities have a wide variety of languages, especially in Africa (Côte d'Ivoire has over 60 according to the Talk section), It is only fair to consider a city francophone if it is the main shared language in which the majority of the inhabitants are fluent, no? It is an imperfect science, but I can't see including Montréal and Paris but not Kinshasa and Abidjan. --Djwhitten (talk) 13:07, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
For me, a Francophone city is one in which a majority of residents speak French natively. Montreal qualifies because the native-Anglophone community is a minority. Kinshasa does not qualify because while a majority of people speak French, they do so as a second (or third, etc.) language. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:49, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
If French is, as Wikipedia puts it, "the language of street signs, posters, newspapers, government documents, schools; it dominates plays, television, and the press, and it is used in vertical relationships among people of different social classes", I'd say Kinshasa would qualify as a Francophone city. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:29, 17 November 2017 (UTC)