Wikivoyage:Destination of the month candidates

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Here we determine which articles are featured on the Main Page as Destination of the month (DotM), Off the Beaten Path (OtBP) and Featured travel topics (FTT).

Nominate[edit]

You can nominate any article you would like to see featured. Any destination, region, itinerary or event that passes the "What is an article?" test is eligible for nomination.

However, before nominating, please check that the article follows these basic guidelines:

Well-known and/or popular destinations should be nominated as Destination of the Month, while more obscure destinations should be nominated for Off the Beaten Path. Travel topics, phrasebooks, itineraries and other articles should be nominated for Featured Travel Topic. Where applicable, you should propose a good time to visit the destination as a month to be featured.

The basic format of a nomination is as follows:

{{FeatureNom
| place=Destination
| blurb='''[[Destination]]''' is a place of contrasts, and as such it...
| status=Guide
| time=March-June
| nominatedBy=~~~~
| comment=Great article and it's just luvvly-jubbly in the springtime.
| DotMImage=[[File:Destinationimage.jpg|thumb|300px]]
}}

Add a nomination to the end of the appropriate section.

Discuss[edit]

You can comment on any nomination based on timeliness and adherence to the criteria above, just add a bullet point (*) and your signed opinion.

===[[Destination]]===
Great article and it's just luvvly-jubbly in the springtime. TravelNut 25:25, 31 Feb 2525 (EDT)
* Looks nice, but shouldn't the Do section contain more than just quilting contests? ~~~~

Please note that the following are not considered valid reasons to oppose a nomination:

  • "I don't like it." All objections have to be based on the guidelines above: poor formatting, missing information, etc. Personal opinions, dislikes, etc. do not count.
  • "Wrong time of year." Articles are supported or opposed based on their content. Timing can be worked out later.
  • "Wrong type of place." Articles are supported or opposed based on their content. Whether it's DotM or OtBP can be worked out later.

Select[edit]

If an article gets several comments in favor and none against for a week or so, it's eligible to be placed in an appropriate time-slot in the Upcoming queue. If the objections are relatively minor and are being worked on, add them to the Upcoming queue tentatively (add a question mark "?" after the article). Feel free to move the queue around or swap articles if it makes sense. If a nomination clearly does not make the grade and if the objections are not easily fixable, they go into the Slush pile.

Once a nomination has been scheduled, an appropriate banner image and text blurb must be selected. Go to Wikivoyage:Destination of the month candidates/Banners to start that discussion.

Archive[edit]

Discussions for previously selected destinations are kept in the Archive.

Upcoming[edit]

Schedule[edit]

The following queue should contain about six months' worth of upcoming destinations. Note that new DotMs are rotated in on the 1st of each month, OtBPs on the 11th and travel topics on the 21st.

Month DotM OtBP FTT
August 2018 North Vancouver - pending stronger consensus to support Goroka Inca Trail
September 2018 Naples - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support Chicago/Bronzeville - pending stronger consensus to support Rail travel in Germany
October 2018 Gyeongju - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support Valletta - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support Sydney Airport - pending fixes (?) and stronger consensus to support
November 2018 Colonia Keenjhar Lake - pending stronger consensus to support Avoiding travel through the United States - pending stronger consensus to support
December 2018 Denver - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support Baños - pending stronger consensus to support Winter in the Nordic countries
January 2019 Yaoundé - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support Guadalupe Island - pending stronger consensus to support Indonesian phrasebook - pending fixes and stronger consensus to support

These are not cast in stone, and the order can be changed if, for example, an excellent guide for a timely event is found. Whenever a guide becomes a current feature, it should be removed from the list, the discussion archived, and (when changing out Featured Travel Topics) a new month added to the end of the queue. Alternatives are OK; the whole point is to enable some discussion as needed.

Next change[edit]

Decisions regarding which images to use as the banners are made at Wikivoyage:Destination of the month candidates/Banners.

The section below provides an opportunity to see what the upcoming featured articles will look like on the Main Page using the banners that are currently most popular on the above page.

Destination of the Month[edit]

North Vancouver

Hit the trails, slopes or water — or just take in the sweeping views — in Vancouver's mountain playground.

Off the Beaten Path[edit]

Goroka

Colorful performances of traditional music and dance abound each September at this Papua New Guinean town's famous Independence Day sing-sing.

Featured Travel Topic[edit]

Inca Trail

Hike centuries-old paths laid by an ancient Amerindian civilization, past impressive ruins and staggering mountain scenery, all the way to the stone city of Machu Picchu.

Updating[edit]

On the date of the scheduled change, the DotM, OtBP, or FTT should be changed as close to midnight UTC as possible. When the featured page is changed, please follow the following procedures to do so and archive content to the appropriate pages. At each stage, please double-check that you are correctly moving content.

  1. Update the featured articles on the main page by replacing the current 'banner' template section with those of the appropriate banner for the new DotM/OtBP/FTT found in the Next change section above.
  2. Update the Photo credits page with the banner's original image, title and attribution.
  3. Add the former featured article to the appropriate archive page: Previous Destinations of the month, Previously Off the beaten path, or Previous Featured travel topics.
  4. Remove Template:Featurenomination from newly featured article.
  5. For the former featured article, add the appropriate parameter to the pagebanner template (directly after the image filename) to label the page as having been featured previously.
    • For former DotMs, add: dotm=yes
    • For former OtBPs, add: otbp=yes
    • For former FTTs, add: ftt=yes
  6. Archive the newly featured article's nomination. Simply cut-and-paste the nomination section of the newly featured article from this page to Wikivoyage:Destination of the Month candidates/Archive.
  7. Update the Next change section above by adding the banner from the discussion page. View the table in the Schedule section above to determine what next month's change will be, then update the image and blurb in the "Next change" section with that found in the upcoming featured article's nomination.
  8. Archive the newly featured article's banner by cutting-and-pasting all banner suggestions and the associated discussion into Wikivoyage:Destination of the month candidates/Banners/Archive.

Nominations for Destination of the Month[edit]

North Vancouver[edit]

Place: North Vancouver
Blurb: Hit the trails, slopes or water — or just take in the sweeping views — in Vancouver's mountain playground. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Dec-Sept
Nominated by: Dowling002 (talk) 07:16, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
Comment: It has been almost a year since a Canadian city has been nominated and ten years since a city in BC has been nominated. So why not one of the beautiful cities in Canada.

Nomination
Deepcove4.jpg
  • There was discussion about this guide for DotM at Wikivoyage talk:Destination of the month candidates#Vancouver district articles for Dotm? I'd be happy to support, as the article looks good and I understand from the linked discussion that Shaundd will continue to edit and update the article before it's featured (probably in 2019). Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:34, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Support, but is this truly a DotM or would it perhaps work better as an OtBP? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:29, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Very close — A couple of listings lack coordinates and there are some things in Do that should be expended a bit (Festivals etc.), also it would be nice with a few photos in the latter half of the article but this can be fixed fairly quickly, I think. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:45, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Support -- I still need to refresh/expand a number of sections, and some things will need to be rewritten before featuring as Seabus service is expected to improve and a couple of attractions are moving and being expanded within the next 2-3 years, but I'll make sure that's done as it happens. With respect to DotM/OtBP, I'd say DotM is a better fit because people visit it as part of a trip to a DotM destination (Vancouver), but I'm not fussed either way. Note - I changed the featuring time to Dec-Sept. The fall, particularly Nov, isn't a great time to visit. It's between summer and snow season and the weather is usually awful (rain and more rain). I was also thinking a catchier blurb could be, Take in the views, or hit the trails, slopes or water, in Vancouver's mountain playground. Feel free to ignore/edit as fit. -Shaundd (talk) 01:32, 19 June 2017 (UTC)
Shaundd - There's no doubt that Vancouver itself is DotM rather than OtBP (in fact, it was DotM in June 2005, before we started running OtBPs, but if we were to rerun it today it would clearly be the former and not the latter). However, when talking about how to categorize a Huge City district article, the comparison to make is with other districts of the same city. Take Toronto for instance: Canada's own Great White Way, Yonge-Dundas, would clearly be DotM, while the spread-out and suburblike Etobicoke would be OtBP. I have no familiarity with Vancouver, but you obviously do. So, imagine you're a first-time visitor with a workable but limited amount of time to spend there, and think about which districts you'd spend the most time in, and you'll be a long way toward an answer. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:41, 19 June 2017 (UTC)
Ah OK, thanks for clarifying. On that basis, I'd still lean towards DotM, although it depends on how far you take "limited amount of time". If you only have one day in Vancouver, you're probably not going to spend it in North Vancouver (most people would probably cover two or three of the City Center, West End/Stanley Park, Granville Island and Gastown). After that though, it's fair game for day two or three, I'd say. Two attractions often appear on top XX list of things to see in Vancouver (Grouse Mountain and the Capilano Suspension Bridge) and the Grouse Grind is considered one of the busiest hikes in Metro Vancouver (and it gets tourist traffic too). It's also really easy to get to from the city center -- you just hop on the Seabus and take a 12 minute ferry ride (which plenty of tourists do) -- and the City of North Van is adding a number of attractions that are within a 5 min walk from the Seabus station. I'm not fussed either way, but I'd say many travellers who spend at least three days in Vancouver probably spend some time in North Vancouver. And for what page view stats are worth, North Vancouver is (on a monthly average) second in page views to the City Center. -Shaundd (talk) 02:23, 20 June 2017 (UTC)
Definitely a gray area, but based on what you said, I would also lean toward DotM. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 03:43, 20 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Support - Looks good to me, and I trust Shaundd and others to edit anything that needs editing. Maybe the exact positions of the start and end of the hiking and mountain biking trails listed in "Do" should be clearly indicated, but otherwise, everything appears to have coordinates. The one thing I noticed that seems weird to me is: Why are the fees for the water slide at the Fun City Festival listed in US dollars and not Canadian dollars? Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:53, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
The slide is run by a US company and the only way to purchase tickets is online through their website -- which prices things in USD. If things change for 2018 (they haven't posted details yet), I'll update it.
Does anyone know a guide that handles multiple hiking trails on a dynamic map well? I'm concerned adding markers for trailheads/endpoints is going to further clutter what is already a pretty busy map. If I have time, I'll look at drawing a static map, but that's a big if at this point. -Shaundd (talk) 23:04, 6 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. It's quite a long article with a lot of useful information about the place. Selfie City (talk) 01:10, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Berlin[edit]

Place: Berlin
Blurb: Germany's capital was at the heart of the Cold War and still bears the scars of wars and partition, but it is quickly reclaiming its place as one of Europe's - if not the world's - top cities. A vibrant cultural scene and surprisingly affordable prices make this "poor but sexy" city a draw for visitors and residents from all over the globe (again, I am not too happy with my blurbing skills) (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Usable, but imho only because nobody has promoted it to Guide yet; all districts are usable or guide, so that's not what's keeping it Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: any - Berlin weather is terrible year round (though Spaniards falling in love with Berlin summer on holiday only to be miserable during their winter-Erasmus are surprisingly common) and there is really something to do all year (which might explain why Hertha BSC has trouble attracting fans)
Nominated by: Hobbitschuster (talk) 17:45, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
Comment: I know we have more than enough German language places "in the pipeline", but I just wanted to get this nominated there's no rush to get this actually featured; it can well languish here if some considerations make this necessary, but in case we have to slush something on short notice, I want this to be ready

Nomination
Bikinihaus Berlin-1210760.jpg
  • Comment - this is currently rated at usable, simply because I did not unilaterally want to promote it to guide. I think it is quite ready, but a bit of copy-editing might still be necessary. At any rate, we can safely hold this one in reserve (we have a lot of Central European places and topics as is imho) until we need an emergency replacement Hobbitschuster (talk) 17:47, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost some sections are listy, and then there are listings in See and Do that should be moved to the district articles. As such, I'd say there is enough information in the article so that the average visitor wouldn't have to consult another travel guide. Therefore, it can probably be upgraded to guide status. --ϒpsilon (talk) 19:03, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Close, the main problem being the issue Ypsi brought up about "See" and "Do" listings that need to be devolved to district articles (there also seem to be some "Do" listings that violate our tour policy and should thus be deleted outright). Also, though it's not usual practice to do so, I wonder if there's anything that can be done about the exhaustive list of embassies and consulates in "Cope". If not, no big deal - Berlin is a national capital, after all - but it seems pretty Yellow Page-y. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 22:51, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Another thing: The article currently has no routebox whatsoever. How important should the existence and completeness of a routebox be for featuring? Hobbitschuster (talk) 15:34, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Before featuring, I'd like somebody to go over the language and a sprucing up of the district blurbs. Otherwise I think the article is fine and getting better. And the district layout now makes sense for the most part, though I am still not 100% sure what to do with Wedding... Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:09, 23 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support. I would support this completely, except that the "Do" section has some problems and the article seems to be understand- and get in- heavy. Selfie City (talk) 01:15, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Colonia[edit]

Place: Colonia
Blurb: On the shore just opposite Buenos Aires is a picturesque historic town, full of cobblestone streets lined with colonial architecture. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Probably September–April
Nominated by: —Granger (talk · contribs) 23:17, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
Comment: As discussed (briefly) at Talk:Colonia. It's a much smaller destination than our typical DotM, but I think its popularity within the region and position on the "Gringo Trail" probably make it better suited for this than for OtBP. (This is my first time nominating something for the main page—I hope I'm doing it right!)

Nomination
Colonia-Calle San Pedro-TM.jpg
  • Support as nominator. I've been in Colonia for several weeks now and have expanded and updated the article quite a bit. I'll still be here until mid-November if there are any concerns that require someone "on the ground" to address. —Granger (talk · contribs) 23:17, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Support - Dunno if anything needs to be added, but if you stuble upon some nice shop, restaurant or bar, do let future visitors know about it. As a top destination in a country that's somewhat off the beaten path, Colonia is an article that I think can work both as DotM and OtBP. --ϒpsilon (talk) 16:03, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. I'm leaning toward DotM rather than OtBP as the category, and toward November 2018 as the time to feature - we could run it sooner, but November is probably the hardest month of the year to schedule for, and if we have a suitable candidate now I'd just as soon save the headache. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 01:43, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Support - It seems like this article is an easy feature: no glaringly obvious grammar or spelling problems, lots of content, plenty of good pictures, easy and fun to read. The only nit-pick I have is that the banner looks a bit dreary. I don't think that's any reason to not feature it, however. DethDestroyerOfWords (talk) 15:40, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. I'm not crazy about the "Do" section but I think the article in general is a good choice for OtBP, not so much as a Destination of the Month. Selfie City (talk) 01:18, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Denver[edit]

Place: Denver
Blurb: Don't be fooled by discounted hotel rooms and the relative lack of tourist crowds: the Mile High City in winter makes a great homebase for skiers and snowboarders hitting the slopes of the Front Range. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Anytime except spring, but winter 2018-2019 would be an interesting time (and, given the looks of the upcoming year or so on the schedule, probably the earliest it could be featured)
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:40, 28 September 2017 (UTC)
Comment: In the Northern Hemisphere winter, it's always nice for a change to run an article where cold weather during the "Time to feature" is a pro rather than a con. Let's carve out a space for a destination that's neither tropical nor Antipodean!

Nomination
2003-11-30-16th Street Mall Lights.jpg


  • Close. Though there are numerous issues with this article, they're all pretty easy fixes: some sections need to have their listings alphabetized, "Drink" has some naked bullet-point listings that need to be filled out ("Breweries" and "Music venues" subsections) or that lack geo coordinates (both of the foregoing subsections plus "Coffee" and "Nightclubs"); live music venues belong in "Do" rather than "Drink"; the information on altitude sickness is largely redundant to what's already written in the travel topic article on the subject and can be excised; some of the tours listed in "Do" look like they might not be value-added; "Go next" needs to be redone. Still, this doesn't constitute as much work as it might look like, and we have north of a year in which to do it. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:40, 28 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Comment given that it is listed on our United States without a car guide, we might wish to expand and update those sections a bit. Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:11, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost support No big issues with this article. Some coordinates are missing here and there and there are long stretches without any photos and like Andre I also noticed there's a section dedicated to tours, some of which may not comply with our tour guidelines. And, as always, a while before the artilce goes on the main page we need to check if everything is still in business, prices are still correct, links still work etc. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:53, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. I haven't spent any time reading through the article, but I can tell that this article is well-formatted and has a lot of information about this well-known city. Selfie City (talk) 00:03, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Sarajevo[edit]

Place: Sarajevo
Blurb: Surrounded by mountains on three sides, in this meeting point of east and west a range of sights present the city's dramatic and interesting history. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: May-Sep as a summer destination, though there are also some winter events and winter sports facilities (actually the 1984 Winter Olympics was held here)
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 17:58, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
Comment: We've never featured any article from anywhere in the Balkans, so let's amend that now! The article has been extensively edited as of lately, so we don't need to run everything through Google to check if it's up to date like we usually have to. I don't see any major problems with the article, but it does have a ton of See listings. Discussion is underway for what to do with them (see numerous threads on Talk:Sarajevo), but there is almost a year until the article will appear on the Main Page anyway, so there is plenty of time to make decisions and take action. When that is resolved, I'll upgrade my vote to full support. Good that we this time we have several people around who know the destination.

Nomination
Sarajevo view.jpg
  • Conditional support per comment. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:58, 1 October 2017 (UTC)
  • I would say districtification would probably be necessary before it gets promoted to Star, but for purposes of DotM I think the status quo works fine. There are no other problems with the article either, so I gladly vote support and send out my congratulations to User:Loaoa for his/her impressive contributions. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 22:41, 2 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. I agree that districtification isn't needed for dotm right now, though if the article gets too much longer it might be worth considering. —Granger (talk · contribs) 01:00, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. Article is very readable, and although there are many See items, they are properly sectioned so I don't think that districtification would provide an added value here. Article looks very complete, why isn't this a Star yet? ArticCynda (talk) 16:57, 20 January 2018 (UTC)
Because the Star nominations page is in practice dead since the last couple of years.ϒpsilon (talk) 17:11, 20 January 2018 (UTC)
But feel free to nominate it if you think that's warranted. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:39, 21 January 2018 (UTC)
So does that mean we're not nominating Stars anymore? And if so, why is that? ArticCynda (talk) 20:51, 2 February 2018 (UTC)
We are working to increase the number of active Wikivoyage editors. In the interim, however, it has sometimes proven difficult to sustain consistent participation in certain features of the site. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:54, 2 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. It's pretty long, but in general I think the article looks like a fine feature. Selfie City (talk) 01:21, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Gyeongju[edit]

Place: Gyeongju
Blurb: Centuries of Korean history await you in the capital of the ancient Silla Kingdom, nowadays also famous for its pastries. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: "Late fall is the best time to visit..."
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 21:03, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
Comment: As you can see on the article's talk page it wasn't exactly yesterday I and some others were looking at Gyeongju as a potential DotM candidate, and here it now finally is. We have had South Korean destinations on the main page before as OtBPs (the last time in 2011), but never as DotM, let's change that!

Nomination
2010 Anapji Pond.JPG
  • Support --ϒpsilon (talk) 21:03, 16 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost – some listings need coordinates, but other than that it looks good to me. —Granger (talk · contribs) 13:03, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
  • In addition to what Granger said, "Go next" needs an overhaul - the first half of the section consists of individual listings that don't belong in "Go next" (briefly perusing them, it looks like either Gyeongju#See or Pohang#See might be better places for them), and the second half mentions Daegu and Busan but doesn't say why they're of interest to visitors, and contains extraneous information about transportation from Gyeongju that, again, doesn't belong in "Go next". Despite that, I feel I can provisionally support this article as there is still plenty of time until autumn 2018 in which to address these minor issues, though we should maybe also keep an eye on the political situation on the Korean Peninsula (recent calls by some in the U.S. government for families of military personnel to be evacuated from South Korea due to the threat of war strike me as overreactions, and prospects for diplomacy seem to be better than they have in months if not years, but a year is a long time when it comes to this). -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:14, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I think it's a good article, but the formatting, particularly in the "go next" section, could be better formatted, as AndreCarrotflower stated. Selfie City (talk) 13:11, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Yaoundé[edit]

Place: Yaoundé
Blurb: While not a tourist hotspot, in the Cameroonian capital you can find lively markets and interesting architecture, and the city is an important business destination. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Dec-Mar (dry season)
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 19:47, 11 March 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Ticking one more of the never before featured regions off the list — Central Africa (and we haven't had an African DotM in a while!). Yaoundé has extensive articles in German and French so I've translated those and then used Google to get stamp out closed businesses and other outdated info. I recently asked a docent to Yaounde (retired, won't ping them again) and he/she had a quick look at the article and said there's nothing important missing. So... what do you say? Do we have a suitable winter article right here?

Nomination
Musée National du Cameroun 01.JPG
  • Support as nominator, I guess. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:47, 11 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Tentative support. Impressive work. My only concern is that many of the listings just have general locations rather than exact addresses, but I don't know how realistic it is to give exact addresses in Cameroon. —Granger (talk · contribs) 11:33, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: Is it possible to make a map of the districts or to organize them differently? Although the text claims it is "helpful" to know, that list is extremely long. Are they all equally useful or could the most useful be listed while the others are dropped or grouped together somehow? Maybe just list the ones the traveler are most likely to visit/be directed to along with any to avoid?

There are a bit too many pictures and some of low quality and appeal that could be deleted. Are all of the "cuisine" listings specific to Yaounde or could some be moved to the general Cameroon page? Most of them seem like general Cameroon foods. For those that are relevant, do we have listings for places where you can eat them? Are the supermarkets necessary? It looks like contentless clutter. Overall, it's a decent article, but the large amount of lists kind of overshadow the listings that do have content. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 11:47, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

  • Support Looks pretty great! There's a lot of good information here. I think we should nominate this, and that way we can get an African destination as a DotM. Selfie City (talk) 13:24, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Not yet, possibly not at Guide status. This article needs pretty extensive work before it can be featured. There are a lot of pointless overlong lists, such as in the "Orientation", "Buy", and "Eat" sections, that seem to function as filler more so than imparting any truly valuable information. For instance, is it really necessary to list every single residential neighborhood in the city, with seemingly no regard to the presence or absence of anything interesting to visitors in each one? I'd say confine the list to quartiers that contain at least one POI or are prominent enough to be mentioned elsewhere in the article, and delete the rest. Similarly with the naked bullet-point listings for "small markets [that] can be found all over the city"; are they really interesting to visitors, or are we including them just for the sake of having them? And I echo ChubbyWimbus' comments about the "Eat" section; most of these are Cameroonian dishes in general rather than specific to Yaoundé, and thus belong in Cameroon#Eat. Also, there are a lot of naked POIs with no blurbs, or blurbs that consist only of directions to the place. Can we find information on all these places, or should they be deleted too? And - perhaps most importantly - if we find that most of this information is indeed mostly fluff, and have to delete it, will there be enough left in this article that it's truly at Guide status? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:14, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment For the record, I've removed most of the districts, moved the dishes to the Cameroon articlen and hidden the small markets and supermarkets. --ϒpsilon (talk) 18:31, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Zurich[edit]

Place: Zurich
Blurb: Switzerland's largest city and financial centre is famous for winter sport, festivals, nightlife and luxury shopping. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Anytime 2019. Winter allows skiing. Spring and summers are full of festivals, and autumn is beautiful.
Nominated by: Yvwv (talk) 15:50, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
Comment: A stable article with the essentials. Nominated in 2016-17; comments requested a restructuring of the See section, a broader selection of photos, and a Talk section. A history section would also improve the article.

Nomination
Zurich in night1.jpg


  • Comment: We slushed this article last year. The comments in the archived thread should be a good barometer of what issues still need to be addressed before Zurich can be featured. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 16:09, 10 May 2018 (UTC)
One objection was the excess of Germanophonic destinations. That is no longer an issue. /Yvwv (talk) 15:30, 11 May 2018 (UTC)
History, climate and language sections have been added. /Yvwv (talk) 12:05, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
I would argue that we still tend to have too many Germanophone destinations "in the pipeline" to feature any that is merely "meh". If there is an outstanding article, by all means, we should feature it, but if we have to chose from articles of similar quality, geographic balance should be one of the tiebreaking factors imho. Hobbitschuster (talk) 12:15, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I think the article is okay for a DotM, but the latter parts of the article need more pictures and the article itself could probably do with fewer listings - they're pretty overwhelming and hard to maintain for us. Selfie City (talk) 23:38, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
Could Zurich make April 2018? It is Sechseläuten, and some nearby ski resorts are still open. /Yvwv (talk) 13:32, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
No, that was already two months ago. :D ϒpsilon (talk) 14:19, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
D'oh! April 2019, I mean. / Yvwv (talk) 13:53, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Close Some listings still need coordinates, and the bottom third of the article could use some photos. ϒpsilon (talk) 14:19, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Siem Reap[edit]

Place: Siem Reap
Blurb: Right next to Angkor Wat, Siem Reap is full of sights and experiences. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Nov-Apr
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 18:42, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
Comment: The nominations page is filled to the brim with (Northern Hemisphere) summer destinations, but many of next winter's slots are still open. So how about this one for next winter's traditional Southeast Asian Dotm; we haven't presented anything from Cambodia since January 2009. Many listings are probably outdated, but as always it's probably better to deal with that closer to the time the article gets featured. Otherwise, the article is quite tidy and certainly not lacking content, so up-to-dateness is really the only reason why I'm not giving the article a full support yet. And yeah, the latter 3/4 of the article definitely needs some photos.

Nomination
Siem Reap street.jpg
  • Conditional support per comment. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:42, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support, except for one issue: in the "drink" section, there are several listings with no content. Selfie City (talk) 02:41, 1 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Close. In addition to the foregoing issues, "Get in" needs to be redesigned: there are lots of bullet-point lists that ought to be turned into prose, as well as pseudo-section headers of italicized text that need to be brought in line with proper Wikivoyage format. Secondly, the "Sleep" section is too long: just because the choice of accommodations is "seemingly inexhaustible" doesn't mean we need to list every single option; let's keep the best and get rid of the rest. Also, there are lots and lots of listings without geo coordinates. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:49, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
Yes, I think that's right, actually. I didn't really notice that at first. Selfie City (talk) 01:34, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Naples[edit]

Place: Naples
Blurb: Naples was founded in the 9th century BC, making it one of Europe's oldest cities, with several UNESCO World Heritage sites in its vicinities. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Spring or early autumn
Nominated by: Yvwv (talk) 19:00, 26 June 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Could use an expanded history section. While not necessary, the very simple Metropolitan Naples article could be improved as well.

Nomination
Napoli6.png


  • Not yet, though this article is in much better shape than the last time I checked, and it's closer to being feature-ready than Venice, which (despite my comments to Ypsilon a few weeks ago) needs a lot of work in the short time between now and 1 August, when it's due on the Main Page. If we can get the problems with Naples ironed out - namely, "Do" needs expanding, "Eat" and "Drink" absolutely need expanding, much of "Stay safe" is Captain Obvious, and the "Naples' surroundings" subsection of "See" should be moved to "Go next" - then I'd be in favor of slushing Venice and running Naples in its place. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 01:06, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
Thanks for bringing this up. I've merged "surroundings" section completely into "Go next" now. Selfie City (talk) 02:13, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: I'm growing less and less confident by the day that the admittedly major issues with Venice will be resolved in as little as two months' time, and meanwhile I'm very impressed with the work that User:Pepemanuele is putting into Naples. So I went ahead and put Naples in the September 2018 slot to replace Venice. I'm not sure if Pepe was previously aware of Naples' DotM nomination, but since I pinged him I suppose that he is now. One specific suggestion I would make to him: it's great that you've expanded the "Eat" section and it's even better that you're emphasizing local cuisine, but for the sake of balance it would be good if you could include some recommendable restaurants that serve other types of food. It's easy to imagine that someone from another country who's visiting Naples for a longer period of time, say a week, might get bored with Neapolitan cuisine after a while and feel like a change of pace. This could be as simple as adding an "Other cuisines" subsection with maybe 6 or 12 listings. Same with the "drink" section; yes, the local coffee and wine are renowned, but surely there are places to list besides cafés and wine bars? What about discotheques? Aside from that, I want to again commend the great work that's been put in to this article, and I'd say I'm very close to being able to support this nominee at this time. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 23:48, 30 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I'd say the article looks great and informative. The Eat section isn't arranged like we usually do, but if it's OK (I've remember seeing this on some other guide status articles) I'm not going to complain. The "linea 1" and other icons are nonstandard too, but they are nevertheless informative and give color to the article. I'd rather see the consulates in an open list rather than hidden away, we don't hide them in other articles either even in cases where there are many more of them. ϒpsilon (talk) 20:30, 13 July 2018 (UTC)

Metro Cebu[edit]

Place: Metro Cebu
Blurb: Second largest urban area in the Philippines with the country's second busiest airport. Outlying parts have many beaches, reefs, dive sites & resorts plus the country's most important site for bird watching. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any, but probably best in northern hemisphere winter
Nominated by: Pashley (talk) 13:29, 30 June 2018 (UTC)
Comment: This article was Collaboration of the month for June 2018 & is therefore now rated Guide. It is the main transport hub for the southern Philippines. Many visitors choose to enter the country via Mactan-Cebu International Airport (CEB IATA) rather than via Manila, both because this airport is easier on travellers & because it is more centrally located in the country.

Nomination
Statue of Lapu-Lapu
  • Support as nominator. Pashley (talk) 13:29, 30 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Of course, this is being mentioned now the article finished its period as COTM. I think it's good to have a region article, and while this one could do with some more information still in some sections, I think it's quite a good idea. It's all up-to-date information due to the CotM and all the places underneath it are decent, as we know, so I'm supporting this nomination. Selfie City (talk) 23:07, 30 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Unsure, looks like all the subarticles listed in the Cities section are usable and most of the article looks OK. But Eat and Drink seem a little bit short. --ϒpsilon (talk) 20:38, 13 July 2018 (UTC)
Most travellers will visit only Cebu City and perhaps Lapu-Lapu, so the fact that most of the other articles on towns within the area are barely usable does not bother me much. Clearly improving them would be good, but it is not essential. The exception would be Talisay (Cebu) which is fairly large & important.
On the other hand, it would be nice to get the main cities up to Guide. I think Cebu is close, but it could use copy edits & more under Eat & Drink. L-L has problems; Drink is empty and there are only two Eat listings, far from ideal when you consider it is a tourist town & population is over 400,00. Pashley (talk) 15:44, 19 July 2018 (UTC)
I was a little unclear. Subarticles need only to be at usable status, and all of them are, which is good. It would certainly do no harm to have some of them at guide status, but they do not need to be. Secondly, I see no big problems with the article, though Eat and Drink looked a bit short. So there's no need to replace this one with Cebu City or Olango Island or some other article. ϒpsilon (talk) 16:24, 19 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Instead of making this region article DotM, there are two places within it that might be nominated instead, Cebu City (the area's main tourist destination) for DotM and Olango Island for OtBP (a strange one, about an hour's travel from an international airport but off the main tourist path). Neither is currently rated Guide, but I think both are close. Pashley (talk) 16:01, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Istanbul[edit]

Place: Istanbul
Blurb: Turkey's largest city is divided between Europe and Asia. Once the capital of the Byzantine and Ottoman Empires, it remains a world metropolis today. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Spring or autumn
Nominated by: Yvwv (talk) 21:17, 10 July 2018 (UTC)
Comment: A lenghty article with elaborate district articles. The history section could use more text. Slushed in 2010, but has improved a lot since then. Except the recently featured Ottoman Empire, Turkey has hardly ever been on our front page.

Nomination
İstanbul 4228.jpg
  • I want to vote oppose on political grounds (Yeah, I know, I am a major class A hypocrite, having been there this year) but I know we don't do that here, so *shrug emoji*. That said, if we have an article of equal quality and similar geographic position and so on, we should prefer that over this... Hobbitschuster (talk) 00:52, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

Nominations for Off the Beaten Path[edit]

Chicago/Bronzeville[edit]

Place: Chicago/Bronzeville
Blurb: African-American history abounds in the "Black Metropolis", where Gwendolyn Brooks published poetry in the Chicago Defender, Andrew Rube Foster created Negro League baseball, and Louis Armstrong kept his trumpet singing at the Sunset Cafe to keep Al Capone off his back. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Star (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Apr-Oct
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 16:05, 9 April 2017 (UTC)
Comment: Believe it or not, it's time to start thinking about feature articles for 2018. It's been a while since Chicago has graced our Main Page - the most recent feature was Far Northwest Side, which was OtBP way back in 2015. Here's a Star district article that I've had my eye on for a while now.

Nomination
Bronzeville grafitti.jpg


  • Support as nominator. Looks like the most recent substantive edits were in 2013, but it should be a simple matter to confirm the continued existence, opening hours, phone numbers, URLs, etc. of the listed POIs. Aside from that, there's a nice static map that actually appears up to date, containing most or all of the numerous listings, and - of course, this being a Star article, not to mention a Chicago district - the prose is skillfully and engagingly written. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 16:05, 9 April 2017 (UTC)
  • Support - Hell yes! I've read through this article before. It's a Star, with all kinds of good information. Like you, I trust that it would be acceptably updated before a feature. Given recent troubles with crime in some black neighborhoods of Chicago, it would be important to add a "Stay safe" section that addresses whether or to what extent Bronzeville has or has not suffered from this (I simply don't know enough about Chicago to know which neighborhoods have been affected). Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:59, 9 April 2017 (UTC)
  • As always, listings need to be checked and coordinates would also be useful, nevertheless this is a nice article and I can support it when the aforementioned issues are fixed (no point in updating them right today as it's a full year before we'll see it on the main page). Tangentially we have two Star itineraries in Chicago, Loop Art Tour and Along the Magnificent Mile. I brought them up two years ago and asked if it's OK to feature personal itineraries and consensus was that we should not. However, are these two itineraries "too personal" to be featured as FTT? What do you think? --ϒpsilon (talk) 06:18, 19 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost, needs some updates. I have just compared this with LP's paper guide to Chicago. We have more see listings -16 against the 8 that LP have. (LP does have w:Roloson Houses and w:State Street Village, which might be worth listing and w:Pilgrim Baptist Church which isn't, and does have a stay safe warning, but no eat, sleep or drink listings). I have updated some of the eat & sleep listings, but quite a bit more is needed - with emphasis on the budget sleep listings. I think that the last sentence of Understand could form the start of Stay safe. Overall I would rather have our article than the LP book if I did venture to Bronzeville. AlasdairW (talk) 22:28, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
  • Weak Support. I would say that some sections of the article need much more information, but the pictures, Wikivoyage-style map, decent understand and get in sections, and Chicago/Bronzeville#See make this just about good enough to be a DotM. If some sections of this article were expanded, its nomination would be a very definite yes. Selfie City (talk) 23:52, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Yuryev-Polsky[edit]

Place: Yuryev-Polsky
Blurb: Smack-dab in the middle of the Golden Ring tourist circuit yet relatively little visited, this sleepy old Russian town is gathered around a magnificent 13th-century cathedral. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Jun 2018 preferred, otherwise Apr-Aug
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:02, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
Comment: Ordinarily I'd be hesitant to nominate an article that needs so much work before featuring (see my comments below), but several factors converge to make Yuryev-Polsky IMO the best choice for the still-vacant June 2018 OtBP slot.

For one, the geographical options are limited:

  • the nearby articles on the bracket trend very heavily toward Northwestern Europe (Erlangen OtBP May 2018, Höfn OtBP July 2018, Wales DotM July 2018)
  • through the end of 2018, we're already saturated with the maximum number of North American nominees we can handle (Underground Railroad, FTT July 2018, took the last available slot),
  • the convergence of Downtown Shanghai (DotM May 2018) and Ottoman Empire (FTT May 2018) would make an Asian feature awkward (especially given that we want to stay away from more equatorial regions like the Arabian Peninsula, the Indian Subcontinent, and Southeast Asia around midsummer), and
  • for similar reasons of uncomfortably hot weather, Mediterranean Europe is also less than ideal for a June-July Main Page sojourn.

Secondly, it's worth noting that other than Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk - a Siberian wilderness backwater closer to Seattle than Moscow - it's been since 2013 that we've featured a Russian destination on the Main Page.

Finally: though this article appears to be a more-or-less straight translation of its analogue on ru: and there's little if anything more to be gleaned from translating from there, it bears emphasizing that Yuryev-Polsky is part of the "Golden Ring" tourist circuit of Russian historic cities, so the chances are good that we can glean additional information from the Internet to flesh out the listings.

Nomination
Vadimrazumov copter - Yuriev-Polskiy 3.jpg


  • Not yet, though the problems with this article are easier fixes than it may look like at first blush. The most demanding task here is the need to flesh out the "Get around" section. (For starters, it looks like much of the prose in the "Orientation" subsection of "Understand" could be retooled and moved there.) There are many others which, while also major deficiencies, require relatively little actual work to fix:
  • There is no dynamic map, nor any geo coordinates for the listings.
  • The bullet-point lists in the various "Get in" subsections should be converted to prose, and in "By plane", we might want to give directions to the town from the various Moscow-area airports.
  • The "Eat" and "Sleep" sections might need to be expanded; "Drink" definitely does.
  • "Go next" and "See" need to be reformatted to conform with Wikivoyage convention.
  • The article looks like it could use a thorough copyedit.
-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:02, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
I'll take your word for all the things that need to be fixed, but one quick and tangential comment: There is no convergence between Shanghai and the Ottoman Empire. You might as well say there's a convergence between Tierra del Fuego and Alaska, considering the distance and cultural differences involved. Asia is the world's largest continent, and I believe that featuring two places at entirely opposite ends of the continent at the same time should never be considered any kind of issue by us. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:10, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
Yes, but as I said, the majority of Asia is unsuitable for featuring in summer for climatic reasons (which incidentally is why we see a disproportionate abundance of Asian destinations in the Northern Hemisphere fall and winter; this year's relative lack thereof is an anomaly). The Ottoman Empire at its height stretched as far east as Iran and the Caucasus, we already have a Chinese feature, and anywhere south of there is a no-go for the summer. Among regions for which we have Guide-level articles, what other than Russia is left? Japan, which we've seen plenty of on the Main Page in recent years (Kurashiki, Kyoto, Taketomi, Nagoya) and what else? Not much as far as I can see. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:16, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
I get your point. What else there is, I would say, would be primarily hill stations and mountainous areas. There are actually a fair number of them. We featured Shimla some time ago, for example. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:23, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
Parenthetically, "convergence" referred to those two destinations converging on the schedule into relative proximity to one another and to a hypothetical additional Asian feature, not to any presumed cultural or geographical redundancy between them. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:33, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Needs work — André already brought up most things that need to be fixed in the article. In addition several prices given as per 2008, so everything in the article should probably be checked up.
And yes, summer in Northern Hemisphere usually means rain in the tropics north of the Equator (the same goes for Austral summer in the southern tropics) and the during that time of the year places like the Arabian desert are only for hardcore fans of hot weather. So viable Asian places to visit during Jun-Sep probably amount to Russia, some of Central Asia, some of East Asia, and then places in the southern tropics like most of Indonesia. --ϒpsilon (talk) 17:43, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
BTW I came up with an alternative to this one, see #Piton de la Fournaise below. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:14, 17 December 2017 (UTC)
Slush? ϒpsilon (talk) 20:09, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
André? (also, see #Venice's nomination above, probably that one should also be slushed when we're at it) ϒpsilon (talk) 14:33, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
Why the push to slush? Just because we didn't feature Yuryev-Polsky this year doesn't mean we can't feature it next year. Also, Venice is already on the schedule for September, with several months remaining in which its problems can be ironed out. (And please don't underestimate the possibility of that; Underground Railroad is a great example of an article that went from extremely problematic to feature-ready in a short period of time. Thanks go to K7L for his efforts, BTW.) -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:49, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost. The fact that this whole article doesn't have one coordinate marker almost immediately gave me doubts about it. Also, it would be nice if see and do had some listings beside man-made structures. The understand and get in section seem to make this article okay until you realize that the article only has one picture, excluding the banner. Selfie City (talk) 23:59, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Goroka[edit]

Place: Goroka
Blurb: Colorful performances of traditional music and dance abound in September at this Papua New Guinean town's famous Independence Day sing-sing. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Aug to advertise the Goroka Show in mid-Sep, otherwise perhaps even anytime
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 17:24, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
Comment: Trying to tick one of these off the list. I've been working on the article for a few days, but the OtBP country Papua New Guinea is so fascinating that I've caught myself reading about the country and playing with Google Earth for an hour instead of working on the article :). The article was usable when I found it and I believe everything that can be said about the town is in the article now.

Nomination
Goroka.JPG


  • Support --ϒpsilon (talk) 17:24, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Support, it's ready. Ypsilon: as to timing, Aug 2018 is the space I had in mind for Gaspé Peninsula, but in light of our recent conversation about that nominee and the mountain of work I have yet to do on updating the Buffalo district articles for the umpteenth time, I'm going to go ahead and slush Gaspé Peninsula and we can run Goroka in that slot instead. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 18:21, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Support - Looks pretty good, though I moved "Goroka Show" from "See" to "Do", as it's standard practice to list viewing concerts or sporting events in the "Do" section, even though of course you're seeing (and/or hearing) something. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:56, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. Looks good to me! —Granger (talk · contribs) 13:37, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost. It could do with more in the "Understand" and "Get in" sections and a little more information throughout. However, it looks well-formatted and with a little more information it would definitely be a good choice for OtBP. Selfie City (talk) 02:01, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Kamphaeng Phet[edit]

Place: Kamphaeng Phet
Blurb: Otherwise known for ancient walls, forts, temple ruins and Buddha statues, Thailand's "banana capital" holds a ten-day festival to promote its sweet and aromatic fruit. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: September preferred, but could be anytime
Nominated by: RJFF (talk) 21:47, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
Comment: Worth visiting, but little frequented. The banana festival in September is Thailand's longest provincial fair.

Nomination
Kamphaeng Phet04.JPG


  • Support, but what's with the non-standard "Nearby" section? That's not how we handle that kind of thing. Those listings need to be merged into either "See"/"Do" or "Go next". -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 03:35, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
A "Nearby" section is explicitly proposed in the guideline WV:Region article template ("If something is in a tiny rural village too small to justify its own local article, (...) adding a section 'Nearby' in an adjacent city article (before the 'Go next' section).") and also explained in WV:Article templates/Sections#Nearby. "Go next" should only include places that have their own article (but these scattered, rural destinations do not warrant articles of their own), while I find it confusing to place points that are up to 65 km off the main city under the "See"/"Do" sections. To me, the "Nearby" section seems to be the perfect solution for this case. --RJFF (talk) 11:52, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
I argued with another user a few months back about this Nearby section, which apparently is real. Yes, if an attraction is far outside the city it's misleading to put it in the city article's See or Do section (perhaps then in the surrounding region's See or Do). But given that very few articles in practice have it, it does look strange and out of place and I think Nearby should be a subsection of Go next instead it's own section.
  • Support. My instinct is to think the "Nearby" section should be merged to "See"/"Do", but I don't feel strongly about that at all. —Granger (talk · contribs) 12:21, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Support — I don't really have anything to complain about, save for the Nearby section which I think should be a subsection of Go next. ϒpsilon (talk) 14:45, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. I agree with Granger and AndreCarrotflower that the "Nearby" section should be removed and its content put somewhere else, but it's otherwise a well-formatted article with plenty of useful information that will be good as an OtBP. Selfie City (talk) 02:06, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Chapel Hill[edit]

Place: Chapel Hill
Blurb: A scenic campus, ultra-popular sports teams, and the buzz of research and learning at the home of North Carolina's flagship public university. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: August–November or January–March (to get the real Chapel Hill experience, you've got to come when the students are in town)
Nominated by: —Granger (talk · contribs) 02:10, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
Comment: At Wikivoyage talk:Destination of the month candidates#Unfeatured U.S. states, Ypsilon pointed out that no North Carolina destination has ever been featured—let's change that!

Nomination
Old Well.JPG


  • Support as nominator. Thorough article; I don't notice any major omissions or problems. —Granger (talk · contribs) 02:10, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Support, and a case could also be made for DotM rather than OtBP. Again, though, please understand that given the abundance of current U.S. nominees, Chapel Hill is going to have to wait till 2019. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 03:34, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Support Looks good. With so long time before the article goes on the Main Page, a few weeks before it does we need to check that everything is still up to date. --ϒpsilon (talk) 15:07, 10 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. Unlike Keenjhar Lake, Chapel Hill is a very complete article that should be a DotM, especially when you consider that North Carolina has never had a DotM article. Someone could definitely make a vacation out of the Chapel Hill article, which is the kind of service we want every article to be. Selfie City (talk) 22:48, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Keenjhar Lake[edit]

Place: Keenjhar Lake
Blurb: A popular getaway for local people and winter migratory birds alike, in the middle of this lake you can find a 14th century royal grave (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Oct-Mar seems to be previously suggested months for our Pakistani OtBPs
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 12:24, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Time to run another one of our Pakistani OtBP destinations, written up to guide status by Saqib. Per the talk page the article should be good to go; I added the coordinates mentioned in the discussion there and did some copyediting.

Nomination
Keenjhar Lake view 4.jpg
  • Support --ϒpsilon (talk) 12:24, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support Ikan Kekek (talk) 16:57, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. Saqib, you asked me earlier about which Pakistani destination we might feature next, and I regret never getting back to you about that. I think this one is a fine choice. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 18:01, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose. This article needs more content and hardly even passes Wikivoyage's "What is an article?" requirements. If that is all there is to write about in this place, this article will never have the potential to be a DotM. Selfie City (talk) 04:15, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • I think you're misunderstanding things. This is an article about a lake that is halfway between two cities and would be an overly long listing in a city article. If this is all there is to say about the lake, the article is exemplary and should be featured. Show us where in the criteria for judging articles nominated for Off the Beaten Path there is a requirement for a certain length. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:57, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support Gizza (roam) 05:41, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • In response to Ikan Kekek, I'm not saying that there is a length requirement. However, this article is hardly a guide article and it needs more information before becoming a OtBP. Selfie City (talk) 14:23, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
What information do you think it's lacking? Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:01, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
For a start, there needs to be at least 50% more information in Keenjhar_Lake#Understand; information about the local climate climate would be useful. Also, if this is going to be a DotM or OtBP, it should have metric-English conversions because the article will most likely receive many readers from around the world. Also, the "get in" section needs to be broken up more so it is easier for Wikivoyagers to read. The Keenjhar_Lake#See and do section needs more than a shrine and two basic activities, and the "eat" section largely needs to be taken out of paragraph form and have some good listings; there needs to be a drink section or a heading with the word "drink" in it. If these things were improved and the general article was expanded, this article would be ready to be a DotM/OtBP. Selfie City (talk) 22:42, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
Some of what you're asking for seems to be based on the notion that there could be more listings. If you know this, add them. I assume there are not more things to list, and that Saqib knows the park well. I also don't agree on making "Understand" longer just for the hell of it, if that's what you're suggesting, but I do agree that adding a "Climate" subsection would be helpful; that's a good point. I doubt it'll be hard to add, though. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:21, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Valletta[edit]

Place: Valletta
Blurb: History lives in Malta's compact capital: museums, shopping, and culture galore packed into a stunning labyrinth of 17th-century Baroque buildings. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Mar-Dec, though after Oct it gets rainy
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:55, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
Comment: We've got only two 2018 slots left on the schedule: the OtBPs for October and December. I envision submitting nominees for both of those openings, this being one of them, and then, unless consensus disagrees, formally closing DotM to new nominations at least through the end of the summer. (Pinging participants in the recent discussion on the same topic: Ypsilon, Ground Zero, and Hobbitschuster, what do you think of this idea?)

As for Valletta, it's one of the two European Capitals of Culture for this year, so I'd say it's deserving of one of the two coveted spots. (Come to think of it, if it's more desirable to feature Valletta in September, we could actually bump Chicago/Bronzeville down to October without the latter conflicting with any other U.S. articles; let's hear your thoughts on that too.)

Nomination
Cattedrale - panoramio - Gio la Gamb (1).jpg


  • Weak support at present. The article needs a better lede and more pictures, the "Do" section could use expanding, there are a few listings without geo coordinates, and I'm not sure "in debatable order of importance" is a valid way to organize the "See" section. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:55, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost First off, Valletta seems to have been demoted to usable. The article needs geo coordinates, photos, possibly more POIs and an update. And FWIW I imagined Chicago Bronzeville would go into October's slot.
And I don't support a blanket closing down of the nominations, but we could do that for (Northern Hemisphere) summer articles given that spring and summer 2019 are already slowly filling up, almost a year and a half ahead.
Why? Because the next slots we're looking for articles for the winter months 2019. And traditionally it has been about as hard finding suitable articles for slots in the "colder half of the year" as there has been to find suitable months for the tons and tons of summer or shoulder season articles. The articles that sit around for long periods are the likes of Lodz, Palmyra (New York), Brownsville and Groningen, but almost never articles like Entebbe, Praia, Hobart or Merida (Mexico). ϒpsilon (talk) 21:37, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
Ypsilon:
  • Valletta is very clearly a Guide. Granted it's not the most complete Guide-level article on the site, but it's not the least complete one either (Bisbee, as one of many possible examples). I'm not sure what happened there, but I've updated the article accordingly.
  • Chicago/Bronzeville could be featured in October, but now that I look closer, Valletta probably could not be featured in September, the same month we run Venice as DotM - two Mediterranean destinations sharing the Main Page for not 10 but 20 days, I think, is out of bounds.
  • You make a good point about the difficulty of scheduling winter destinations, but it perhaps bears mentioning that once an OtBP nominee is introduced for December 2018 as I indicated above, 50% (6 out of 12) of the available slots for winter 2018-19 will have been filled:
Dec 2018: Denver / new nominee / Winter in the Nordics
Jan 2019: ? / ? / ?
Feb 2019: ? / ? / SS Lusitania
Mar 2019: ? / Chapel Hill / Judaism
-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 22:46, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
  • I must say I oppose featuring Valetta at this point in time. The understand section contains barely anything, the "do" section is a joke, there is the issue with the order of the see section, "get in" is barely adequate and even fails to mention air travel while "get around" did not even have a single subsection until just now. Furthermore there is a weird digression about audio guides which may or may not violate WV:Tour. "Learn" says something about language learning institutes but links to none of them. The article also has surprising language- and flow issues for one covering an English speaking place. This article might be polishable, but with none of us being based out of Malta and English language as well as Mediterranean destinations overexposed as is, I see few reasons besides the capital of culture thing to spend the considerable effort it would take to fix the issues with this article. Hobbitschuster (talk) 23:44, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
First of all, English, though it has official status, is not the majority language of Malta. 95% of Malta's citizens speak Maltese natively, and virtually all of the 89% of Maltese who speak English do so as a second language, with varying degrees of fluency. We went over that point already at Talk:English language varieties.
Secondly, I'm not based out of the Gaspé Peninsula either, and I have been there a grand total of once in my life, for only three days. Despite that, I've managed to bring five articles in that region up to Guide status - Gaspé Peninsula itself, Percé, Chandler, Forillon National Park, and Gaspé - that were previously either nearly-empty outlines or redlinks. Valletta, meanwhile, is already a Guide, and only needs a few minor tweaks. Clearly, the fact that we don't have any editors in Malta is irrelevant. We are not limited to solely firsthand information here; it's perfectly fine to draw from Google, Facebook, Yelp, Tripadvisor, etc. to fill in missing information.
Valletta isn't perfect, but its issues are not insurmountable, certainly not with eight months of advance warning. Frankly, if we're going to sound the alarm about any OtBP candidate, it should be Erlangen, which you nominated almost a year ago and is still in worse shape than Valletta is now only a few hours after I nominated it.
-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 00:08, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
I have more than once offered to do on the ground research on Erlangen if a specific thing is pointed out to me. I don't think the criticism is fair, given that it is incredibly vague and I am perfectly clear as to atrás in which the Valetta article is deficient. And ceteris paribus on the ground knowledge is always preferable to Internet research. Tell me what I should research with regards to Erlangen and I will. But I stand by my opinion that the Valetta article has the mentioned deficits and probably more. Hobbitschuster (talk) 06:04, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
FWIW, this is what I believed the onwards schedule would look like:
Aug: North Vancouver, Goroka, Rail travel in Germany
Sep: Sarajevo, Kamphaeng Phet ("September preferred" according to the nominator), Avoiding travel through the US
Oct: Gyeongju, Bronzeville, Sydney Airport (or other airport)
Nov: Colonia, Keenjhar Lake, Winter in the Nordic countries
Dec: Denver, ?, Inca trail
Jan: ?, ?, Lusitania
Feb: ?, Chapel Hill, ? (some phrasebook?)
Mar: ?, ?, Judaism?
Apr: Venice if not slushed?, ?, ?Roman empire if no Venice
Later: Berlin, Yuryev Polsky, Roman Empire, Vikings, Rail travel in NL
Concerning Erlangen, as I said above there are some listings that lack a description (particularly in Do and Buy), and in the case something has closed down it should be removed, also some photos should be added to the latter 2/3 of the article. Otherwise the article looks quite OK. --ϒpsilon (talk) 08:56, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
  • I know you hate that argument, but I just ran copyscape on Valetta and more than half that article are the same since the migration should we really an article that may well be outdated by over five years in more than half its content? And with that background us not having someone on the ground does exacerbate the issue. Hobbitschuster (talk) 23:42, 4 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost Valletta is the sort of destination where it may not matter if half the text has not changed in a decade, particularly for the see listings. I have done some edits, but I think that there is quite a bit more to do: Understand is 10% of the length it needs to be; Buy needs quite a bit of expansion - are there no department stores?, and if not then we should say where the nearest ones out of town are, a supermarket should be here or in Eat; although there are 16 See listings I think that there are still some missing - e.g. WP has articles on 24 churches, 17 palaces etc. AlasdairW (talk) 23:59, 5 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Not yet. This article doesn't yet have enough solid content in some sections to be a DotM. Selfie City (talk) 04:18, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support. I think this article has just enough information about places to see and could just about be an OtBP. Selfie City (talk) 00:59, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Baños[edit]

Place: Baños
Blurb: Jump, ride, raft, rappel, swing or just relax in a thermal pool — Ecuador's adventure capital offers all kinds of activities in an amazing environment. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Oct-Feb
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 18:52, 23 March 2018 (UTC)
Comment: After translation, updates, rearranging and cleanup, I think the Baños article starts looking like it's ready to represent Ecuador on the Main Page. What do others think?

Nomination
Baños, Ecuador.JPG
  • Support as nominator. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:52, 23 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. The "buy" section needs work, but everything else looks good. Selfie City (talk) 15:32, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. Some minor copyediting and reformatting would be good, but nothing to the extent that it would give me pause if we were to feature this article the way it is today. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:17, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Khasab[edit]

Place: Khasab
Blurb: Off the tourist path, this strategically placed town harbors a former Portuguese fort and modern Iranian smugglers. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Nov-Mar probably, as per w:Khasab#Climate
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 18:16, 31 March 2018 (UTC)
Comment: One of our nice Omani guide articles, which I just polished a little bit. I guess everything important is in the article, given that this is a pretty small and non-touristy town. Musandam Peninsula has been OtBP, but that was back in December 2013, so it shouldn't be a problem.

Nomination
Khasab Castle Musandam Oman.jpg
  • Support as nominator. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:16, 31 March 2018 (UTC)
  • Hmm... I think it needs work. The Car Rentals should be a subheading of "By Car" which should just briefly state how easy/difficult it is to get around by car (by the looks of the map, it may just need to say "Most sites are located along Khasab Road"). If there are no rentacycles, "By bike" might not be worth mentioning. The "See" section could use a bit more information. The first listing is okay, but the second site states it's in city with some dubious conjectures. The Irani Smugglers bit is kind of interesting but it doesn't seem to make sense as a listing. Overall, more concrete information about the sites would be nice in the "See" section. In the "Eat" section, convenience store ice cream isn't worth a listing. The "Drink" section should have some actual listings (places other than the hotel that serve alcohol and places to get the mentioned smoothies). I don't think it's far off, but a bit more information and listings would really help. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 13:24, 12 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support. I'm not crazy about some of the formatting, but I still support this nomination. Selfie City (talk) 02:10, 5 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support. I agree with what ChubbyWimbus identifies as the article's weaknesses, but I don't think they're quite as big a deal as he makes them out to be. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:19, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Conditional support. I agree in essence with ChubbyWimbus's comments. Most of the fixes are fairly straightforward, although there is a bit of organizational and formatting work to do. A couple of the bulleted points in 'get around' I think should be converted to simple prose. The second listing, Al Khmazera Castle, does in fact exist, but I haven't seen it myself and so can't comment on the worthiness of its inclusion here. The listing for the Dhow Port should be moved to 'do', because this is where visitors will pick any boats for dhow cruises or snorkeling and diving excursions. The information about Iranian smugglers is relevant (as it accounts for possibly most of the traffic in the port area); however the smugglers operate out of a different area of the port which should be described and/or geotagged.
The 'do' section should be reorganized, into port-related activities (dolphin-watching cruises, snorkeling excursions, etc.) and other activities. The information about Jebal Harim ('Mountain Safari') should be expanded in the related article about the Musandam Peninsula, as the mountains are outside of Khasab proper and covered, albeit briefly, in the second article.
In the food and drink section, the ice cream listing and the bulleted points in 'drink' should be converted to prose. Regarding actual listings in 'drink', it's been a few years since I visited the place, but I don't recall seeing any juice bars – juices you would commonly order in a restaurant anyway. The handful of cafés I saw were the exclusive domain of local men and not terribly welcoming, and I didn't try any of them. Perhaps other visitors have tried them however and can comment.
I see by looking at the OSM map that there's a newly-opened large hotel on the south side of the port. Given the dearth of accommodation in the town, a listing for this should be added.
StellarD (talk) 12:16, 17 June 2018 (UTC)

Pleasanton[edit]

Place: Pleasanton
Blurb: This city near the Silicon Valley has a cosmopolitan feeling with international cuisine, racial diversity, and a architecturally-rich downtown. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Oct-Nov or Mar-May are the optimal months due to climate, but Dec-Feb could also work
Nominated by: Selfie City (talk) 01:48, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
Comment: I’ve significantly expanded this article over the last few months and it now seems ready for being on something like this. On May 26, I also added a different banner that really improves the presentation of the article.

Nomination
Downtown Pleasanton, California 3 2017-03-12.jpg
  • Support, not just because I’m the nominator and I know the area well, but also because this is now a well-developed article about the place. Selfie City (talk) 01:48, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Qualified support - You've done great work and I trust you that this content-laden guide is comprehensive. However, some work remains. I just made these edits for brevity, and I think the whole article could probably merit the same kind of careful reading and editing for style and brevity. Also, I see the Main Street sign arch in at least 3 pictures, so I think 2 of those should be removed from the article. The remaining images should be distributed a bit more evenly through the article, not bunched up, thereby leaving areas without images. A further comment would be that "By car/Driving" looks too detailed for visitors. I agree with naming and describing the most important roads, but for the rest, I'd rather let readers consult a map. I'll look more closely at other sections another time and may have more comments. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:04, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
I have done some work removing two pictures and removing some listings from "By car/Driving". I will now do some reorganizing of the pictures. Selfie City (talk) 13:25, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
I can get to work on the listings. I don't know a lot about every business I've listed (some, hardly at all), but I could add to some of the listings. Selfie City (talk) 01:56, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
Also, ϒpsilon, having improved the listing in the "eat" section of Pleasanton, I have gone back and checked the link you made to the archive. Pleasanton only has 80,000-90,000 inhabitants, so I would say it's probably OtBP as I initially stated. Selfie City (talk) 14:30, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
AndreCarrotflower: I'm assuming you are referring to the listings in the sections "buy", "drink", and "sleep", which definitely need more information. I'll get to work on this right away. Selfie City (talk) 18:36, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Guadalupe Island[edit]

Place: Guadalupe Island
Blurb: Guadalupe Island is truly off the beaten path, being over 100 miles from the Mexican mainland and nearly impossible to reach - but one of the most dramatic spots on Earth. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any time of year, according to Wikipedia climate data, not large temperature variations in summer/winter
Nominated by: Selfie City (talk) 04:01, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Article I developed with User: Ground Zero a little while ago it's now at guide status. It's an opportunity to get really off the beaten path!

Nomination
Guadalupe june 4-8 014.jpg


  • Support as nominator. Selfie City (talk) 04:01, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment - Classic off-the-beaten-path destination! How confident are you that all the facts are correct? I just corrected one:
Guadalupe has been the last refuge for the northern elephant seal and the Guadalupe fur seal in the 1890s -> Guadalupe has been the last refuge for the northern elephant seal and the Guadalupe fur seal since the 1890s. Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:28, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
Well, a lot of the article (particularly the "Understand" section) is based on the Wikipedia Guadalupe Island article. We have to hope that all the information on here is right, because it's hard to find much else about the island, or not nominate it, of course. Selfie City (talk) 03:50, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support Looks good. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:54, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment. It'll be really hard to find a good banner for this one - just a warning. Selfie City (talk) 15:31, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:21, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Letchworth State Park[edit]

Place: Letchworth State Park
Blurb: Upstate New York's "Grand Canyon of the East", where the Genesee River tumbles over a trio of spectacular waterfalls, preserved through the generosity of a prominent 19th-century industrialist. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: May-Oct; as a popular "leaf peeping" destination, Sep or Oct would be especially ideal
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:30, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Originally I had hoped to feature a Buffalo district as OtBP in summer 2019, two years after Historic Churches of Buffalo's East Side's stint as FTT. But given the scope of what needs to happen to those articles between now and then - updates to weed out closed businesses and add listings to new ones, shortening lengthy blurbs, and possibly further subdividing the articles themselves, not to mention wrapping up the Gaspé Peninsula project at the same time - any such feature will likely have to wait until 2020. Here's a good article to run in its stead.

Nomination
Letchworth State Park Middle Falls 2002.jpeg


  • Support as nominator. I'm interested in hearing the thoughts of Powers, the article's principal author. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:30, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost: any issues can most likely be fixed before this is featured. This article should be more helpful to the traveler before being turned into an OtBP. For example, the climate subsection is completely empty, buy, eat, and drink should have more content, and only the sleep section has any coordinate markers. A good article needs plenty of coordinate markers, especially for attractions like this one, so people know exactly where the attractions can be found. The good thing is that the lack of coordinates is an easily problem to solve and can be easily done before this is featured. When we've fixed the coordinate issues, we should also add a dynamic map (that's what they're called, right?) so tourists get a better idea about the place. Still, it looks like a really nice place for Off the Beaten Path. Selfie City (talk) 18:33, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
Selfie City - the reason why "Buy", "Eat", and "Drink" don't have more content is because there isn't much content to add in the first place. State parks aren't shopping or nightlife meccas; what more do you feel needs to be said about the few unremarkable gift shops within the park boundaries? As for "Eat", the Glen Iris Inn is a renowned fine-dining restaurant, but we have a policy of not double-listing the same establishment in multiple different sections, so all the information is in "Sleep". As for the coordinate markers, policy says they're not required in articles with static maps (which include the markers directly on the image file, making coordinates redundant). However, I agree with you that this particular static map is pretty useless and we'd do well to jettison it in favor of a dynamic one, which would entail adding coordinates to the listings. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 16:03, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
I've solved some of the problems by merging eat and drink - however, more information about the Basics would be useful. Also, I understand that coordinates are not required for articles, but I still think they're extremely useful to the traveler and should be included in any one of our featured destinations. Selfie City (talk) 16:15, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Very close...heck, I'll say support right away. Adding someting to the climate section and coordinates to the couple of listings that still lack them (it can be useful even if there isn't an embedded dynamic map in the article; readers can click on the icons and open one), and perhaps a photo in the end of the article are things that anyone can do in a couple of minutes. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:01, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

Great Basin National Park[edit]

Place: Great Basin National Park
Blurb: Ironically considering its name, this mountainous national park includes juniper forests, caves, a gorge, and the great Wheeler Peak, one of Nevada's highest mountains. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Apr-Oct; particularly Apr-Jun or September
Nominated by: Selfie City (talk)
Comment: I think it could do with a little work that I can mostly likely do in expanding some sections, but at the same time not a lot more can be said. What's existing in the article is what is there, so I think in general this article is pretty complete and would definitely be appropriate for OtBP. I was originally going to do somewhere else but I think this one will work well, actually.

Nomination
Stella Lake Great Basin.jpg


  • Support as nominator. Selfie City (talk) 02:03, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: Due to how many OtBP candidates are already waiting in the wings (and how many of those are U.S. destinations), there'll be no room for this one on the Main Page till 2020 at the earliest. Let's hold off on any additional OtBP nominees for awhile. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 02:35, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
Yes, sure. Selfie City (talk) 14:02, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Nominations for Featured travel topic[edit]

Rail travel in Germany[edit]

Place: Rail travel in Germany
Blurb: Germany's railways enjoy a superb reputation abroad and trains are often the fastest, most comfortable and sometimes cheapest way around the country (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any; preferably not December (schedule change)
Nominated by: Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:54, 2 March 2017 (UTC)
Comment: I think some work may need to be done still but this could go live tomorrow without causing me too much headache

Nomination
ICE Velaro D Köln Hauptbahnhof 2015-12-17-03.JPG


  • Somehow this nominee fell through the cracks. Good work, Hobbitschuster. Voting support with no reservations. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 14:12, 27 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Support. You're on the right track. K7L (talk) 16:17, 27 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Comment: Complaining about Deutsche Bahn and comparing it (unfavorably) to railroads in France, Switzerland, Japan or Italy is a particular "hobby" of a large subset of the German population. Meanwhile next to all non-Germans (excluding the Swiss, that is) who have an opinion on DB consider it an excellent transportation choice. The article currently partially reflects the latter but makes no allusions to the former. Is this the right approach or should we give the "Bahn-Nörgler" the light of day? Hobbitschuster (talk) 18:54, 27 March 2017 (UTC)
  • I think exactly the kind of statement you just made would be good to put in the article. I'm really busy with professional and personal stuff right now, but I'll have a look through the article when I have sufficient time and mental space. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:17, 27 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Support This article is a pretty good one. I don't see any obvious issues with it, having just given it a quick read-through. It has answers to everything a traveler might have questions about (and a few things they might not think to ask, such as the bit about passenger rights). DethDestroyerOfWords (talk) 15:22, 9 May 2017 (UTC)
  • Support it's a really good-looking article, at least at a first glance. When the article is about to go live, we maybe need to check that all external links are still alive. ϒpsilon (talk) 15:09, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Support on the condition that a good look is taken at it before it goes live. Maybe User:Griffindd and User:Xsobev who have also contributed to this article in the last months want to weigh in as well? Hobbitschuster (talk) 23:08, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
  • Comment some fo the night trains and trains that also carry automobiles have since been rerouted, canceled or new ones introduce. This should be checked before the feature goes live. Hobbitschuster (talk) 11:55, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. The article looks great. Selfie City (talk) 00:56, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment So in addition to the night train thing mentioned above DB announced an overhaul of their ticketing system effective August First. I am not sure I will have the time and wherewithal to fit that into the article, and it obviously shouldn't be featured without that information. Anybody willing to assist me in that task? Hobbitschuster (talk) 11:50, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Judaism[edit]

Place: Judaism
Blurb: Over its long and often fraught existence, the world's oldest monotheistic religion has left its mark on history and culture all over the world — from the Holy Land to Europe to East Asia to the Americas. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Anytime
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 18:35, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
Comment: As a discussion on this article's talk page indicates, many of us have had their eye on this article as a possible FTT for some time now. Though it's recently been elevated to Guide status and is thus eligible to be nominated (preferably for the March 2018 FTT slot which is currently vacant), Ikan Kekek earlier had expressed some doubts as to whether the article was yet complete enough to be featured. I'd love to hear whether, four months after having originally made that comment, his opinion has changed.

Nomination
425.Wailing (Western) Wall.Jerusalem.jpg


  • Despite being the nominator, I can't in good conscience vote "support" for the article as is. However, we have a goodly amount of time to attend to its needs, which as I see them comprise adding geo coordinates for all the listings in "Cities" and "See" that don't yet have them, as well as lengthening descriptive blurbs in most cases, and perhaps expanding the "Eat", "Drink", and "Buy" sections (in descending order of how much additional detail IMO should be added). This may not be an exhaustive list of the article's issues (again, I hereby solicit Ikan's opinion on the matter) but again, the March '18 slot is vacant. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 18:35, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
  • The article is in much better shape than before, due to a lot of hard, smart work. I think there are still some more cities that should be added, and we also may want to think about what should be in "Cities" and what should be in "See". Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:44, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Conditional support As I said on the talk page some coords are still missing, but on the other hand I don't know much about Judaism so I can't myself tell if everything important is in the article. But I'm ready to support the article when Ikan and other central contributors think it looks good for the main page. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:59, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
So... is this still "work in progress"? There are two months before it's scheduled to be featured and it doesn't have even one full support vote. Sure, like with most travel topics, we can feature them anytime of the year but still... ϒpsilon (talk) 20:12, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
  • I would solicit the opinion and comments of Ar2332, whose great work is most responsible for the great improvements in this article. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:19, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
    • There is still work to be done. The "See" section is generally missing sites in Israel. The "Cities" section still needs work, in terms of content and focus. The relationship between the "Cities" and "See" sections needs to be clarified. Ar2332 (talk) 22:01, 17 September 2017 (UTC)
  • I agree with Ar2332. The "city" and "See" sections seem like they should be merged. The distinction is really unclear. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 02:36, 18 September 2017 (UTC)
  • March/April would be suitable, as it coincides with Passover/Easter. /Yvwv (talk) 05:10, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Again, the March 2018 FTT slot is vacant, and I intended to fill it with this. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 05:17, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
  • This is indeed still a work in progress, as the relationship between "Cities" and "See" still needs to be clarified. I think this is a "Not yet" for now. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:09, 20 January 2018 (UTC)
I'd suggest places with several Jewish sites should go in Cities, and these sites would be described in the listing of the city. "Standalone" attractions, ie. those that are in cities that aren't otherwise notable for their Jewish heritage can be listed in See. I can help with adding coordinates for sites and cities but not really much more.
Andre, looks like we need a plan B for March's FTT. Should we move Ottoman Empire, Advice for nervous flyers or something else to March (making room for Vikings and the Old Norse in the summer) or run Hostels? ϒpsilon (talk) 10:28, 28 January 2018 (UTC)
Vikings and the Old Norse still needs quite a bit of work before it goes on the Main Page, IMO, and with Ottoman Empire the question would be what to replace it with in the May 2018 slot. I'd say the least disruptive course of action would be to run Hostels in March. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:11, 28 January 2018 (UTC)
Yes Done. As for this article, it's come a long way and will make a fine feature when the "Cities"/"See" issue is sorted out, so I'm going to refrain from slushing it and instead say that it would make a good feature for next year's Passover. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 00:51, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

Roman Empire[edit]

Place: Roman Empire
Blurb: The Roman Empire encircled the Mediterranean two thousand years ago and left many marvellous ruins. Its heritage has influenced much of the world. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Usable (deserves a higher grade) (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Spring or autumn
Nominated by: Yvwv (talk) 04:56, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Comment: A highlight in the historical travel series. The marker counter is capped at 99; maybe we can find a workaround?

Nomination
Colosseum in Rome-April 2007-1- copie 2B.jpg


  • I want to vote Support here, because it's a well-written article on one of my personal favorite historical subjects. However, I'm not sure if the marker counter being capped at 99 is a bug so much as a feature. The plain fact of any article having over 99 listings (even a travel topic article, and especially an article with a dynamic map) is a pretty big red flag for me that says maybe we need to think about whether all of these places really need to be listed, or whether it should be split up into smaller articles (much as previous FTT Fundamentals of flying was), perhaps with Roman Empire itself serving as sort of a "Huge City" analogue: a summarization of and portal to the more fine-grained information in the daughter articles. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 05:29, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Conditional support. The 99 problems (now I got Jay-Z's song on continuous replay in my head, thanks a lot :P) need to be fixed. One possible workaround would be splitting them up geographically (e.g. 1. today's Italy, 2. France+Iberia, 3. British Isles+Central Europe+Benelux, 4. Balkan+Greece, 5. Turkey+Middle East, 6. Northern Africa) and use different markers for destinations in different regions. ϒpsilon (talk) 11:04, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Not yet; there are just too many listings. I think many of them should be pushed down to destination articles and just a summary (maybe with listing for cities, but not individual attractions) kept here. A recent discussion of a similar issue is at Wikivoyage:Travellers'_pub#Downtown_Shanghai. Pashley (talk) 18:31, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost. The listing types should be changed to use different colours, and to avoid the present problem of having eight #1 listings. Individual listings should be trimmed to remove phone numbers, hours, prices etc, and these should be in a linked destination article. A bigger job is that all the destination articles need to be checked to see that they have related listings with the full details - I found four listings in Algeria linked to Batna but only one was in the very outline article. I don't think that there are too many listings - I would actually say the reverse that there are a few sights are missing (no Antonine Wall in Scotland). A few listings might be combined, but not many as most listings appear separately on the map at a zoom of 8. AlasdairW (talk) 20:45, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Well, what does a good article do? Does it include every possible listing, or does it try to avoid overwhelming the reader with too much information (not to mention the static map with too many markers, a problem that the proposed color-coding solution doesn't address)? I think the answer is pretty clearly the second option. I think this article really needs to be split up in the same way as Flying is split up into Planning your flight, At the airport, On the plane, and Arriving by plane. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 21:16, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Breaking it out into Roman Britain, Roman France etc would be fine, just having a paragraph about the countries with more than a dozen or so listings, with a link to a country article. On reflection, a paragraph introducing each country would be a worthwhile addition (when was this territory part of the Roman Empire etc). AlasdairW (talk) 21:51, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Let's remember that unless we're fine with having laundry lists of attractions, if the main Roman Empire article is splitted up, we also need to add more content to each of those subarticles. ϒpsilon (talk) 16:45, 23 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Comment. I really look forward for a solution to the "99 problems" and the completion of this article - it's very incomplete yet (p. ex. Skopje and Sevastopol both deserve to be mentioned), as I stopped adding to it when this bug got evident. For the record, I don't like very much the idea of splitting up the article, as it has already been very useful to me for reference purposes, both on planning stages for trips, and on the field itself. Having said that, I can very clearly see Pashley's point stated above, and don't want to suggest any hint of being "jealous" or "possessive" about what is written in the article. To be brief: Not yet. Ibaman (talk) 15:49, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
    • The Ottoman Empire is now nominated as an FTT. IMO, that article should go first. /Yvwv (talk) 18:37, 26 October 2017 (UTC)
  • Slush? Still only at usable status. Moreover, we'll have Vikings and the Old Norse in the summer of 2019, and I've envisioned Magellan-Elcano circumnavigation for a summer month 2019 too, as it will be 500 years since that journey started. And three historical topics within about half a year is perhaps a little too much. --ϒpsilon (talk) 20:15, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support in the long term. I'm not sure why Palmyra is a red marker and all the others are green, but other than that, the article seems well-developed and good enough to be guide status. However, with several other historical topics (like the Ottoman Empire) this summer, and all the issues addressed above, let's leave this nomination up here a little while longer and maybe see this article develop some more. Selfie City (talk) 04:23, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Because Palmyra was largely destroyed by IS. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:17, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
That makes sense (I've read a book about the city), but I still think the red marker will be more confusing than informative. Also, it interrupts the flow of the numbered listings (it shows up as listing #1 but would normally be #38). Selfie City (talk) 23:21, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Vikings and the Old Norse[edit]

Place: Vikings and the Old Norse
Blurb: The Old Norse were the ancestors of Scandinavians. The most famous were the Vikings; sailors who ventured around Europe and across the Atlantic in the 8th to 11th centuries. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: April-September. Preferrably June/July or July/August, as most outdoor events take place in summer.
Nominated by: Yvwv (talk) 04:54, 28 December 2017 (UTC)
Comment: The article has grown over time, and now has an impressive history section, and a long list of destinations.

Nomination
Ask Birk.jpg


  • Comment: It's interesting and likely to get my vote, but a quick read of the first few paragraphs demonstrated to me that this article is going to need to be edited with a fine-toothed comb, for both clarity and standard, clear English. I think the editing will take a while, but the content certainly looks to be there. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:09, 28 December 2017 (UTC)
  • Almost Otherwise a good article, though I would imagine there'd be a some more places in Iceland and Norway worth listing. --ϒpsilon (talk) 10:40, 1 January 2018 (UTC)
  • In addition to the relative dearth of Icelandic and Norwegian POIs pointed out by Ypsilon, it's strange that the article simply ends abruptly after the lengthy list of "Locations". If there nothing to say in the realm of "Stay safe"? No "Related topics" to delve into? -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:29, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support, can't tell if the article needs copyediting, but it's probably better to let native English speakers take care of that :). I recently added a stash of destinations in Norway and Iceland, and a See also section with some links. For Stay safe; well the Nordic countries are nowadays some of the safest in the world so I don't really know what to add. If the problems many users have pointed out with the Underground Railroad article aren't resolved, here is a spare article. ϒpsilon (talk) 05:52, 27 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. After scanning through this article, it has plenty of good images and a lot of listings of places like L'Anse Aux Meadows where Viking remains and reconstructions can be found. This definitely ought to be a Featured Travel Topic at some point. Selfie City (talk) 13:44, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
  • I'm belatedly noticing the additions Ypsilon made some months ago, and now I feel I can support this candidate. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:40, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Inca Trail[edit]

Place: Inca Trail
Blurb: Hike centuries-old paths laid by an ancient Amerindian civilization, past impressive ruins and staggering mountain scenery, all the way to the stone city of Machu Picchu. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: "Weather is best May to September"; though as voyagers are recommended to book tickets and start getting fit a full 6 months ahead, Northern Hemisphere winter is probably best
Nominated by: —Granger (talk · contribs) 13:59, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: This is a thorough guide to an incredible trek, and I've addressed the issues raised on the talk page. This would also be our first ever feature from Peru!

Nomination
Sayacmarka.jpg


  • Support. The article does look good; if you've also addressed the tour operator problem, then I think this is good to put on the main page. --ϒpsilon (talk) 15:18, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Not yet.
  • Most of what's in "Understand" — "Acclimatize for at least 2 or 3 days", "Use trekking poles", "Pack appropriately", "Pace yourself", etc. etc. ad nauseam — actually belongs in "Prepare" (and, redundantly, much of it appears to already be there).
  • Also in "Understand" and "Prepare", the non-standard structure of brief snips of text headed up by bold pseudo-section titles needs to be jettisoned in favor of the standard paragraphs of prose we use here.
  • By comparison with the extensive information in the sections preceding it, "Go" — supposedly the meat of the article — seems almost like an afterthought. Interesting-sounding sets of ruins along the trail — Huillca Raccay, Sayacmarka, even Machu Picchu itself — are name-checked but barely (or not at all) described. Remind me again why I'm walking this trail?
  • The "Theft" subsection of "Stay safe" is another section that needs to be converted from its current weird non-standard structure to the prose format we normally use.
-- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:26, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
I've edited the article to try to address these issues. The "Go" section is still on the short side, but I think that's because this is an unusual itinerary: the trail is always done with a guide, so preparation and planning are much more important than details about the route, and the point of going on the Inca Trail is more the overall experience rather than the specific ruins you see on days 1 and 3. Still, I've expanded the "Go" section with more information about the ruins. What do you think? —Granger (talk · contribs) 20:35, 17 February 2018 (UTC)
Regarding "the trail is always done with a guide, so preparation and planning are much more important than details about the route", I always picture the prototypical Wikivoyage reader as someone who's trying to decide where to go, at least within the parameters of some particular broad region, rather than someone who's trying to decide what to do when they get to a place they've already decided to go. For the latter category of traveller, the extensive preparation and planning information would be sufficient; for the former, we go back to my earlier question of why choose this trek out of all the possible ones within one's geographic area of interest? I notice you've expanded the "Go" section, and having no expertise of my own on the region, I have no reason to disbelieve you when you say the point of the trail is the trail itself rather than the ruins along the way. I just have trouble wrapping my head around the idea of an itinerary with such a short "Go" section. I'm going to have to think about this for a while before choosing "support" or "still not yet". -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 21:13, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
I agree that it's important for Wikivoyage to be useful for readers who are deciding where to go, and I think there's a good amount of information in the lead, "Understand", and "Go" sections for those readers. But I'll try to think of more information of this kind to add.
As for the length of the "Go" section, I don't really think it makes sense to judge this article by comparing the length of its "Go" section to the length of most other itineraries' "Go" sections. A lot of other "Go" sections have detailed directions, logistical information, or large numbers of destinations, which wouldn't make sense in the "Go" section in this article. —Granger (talk · contribs) 21:25, 26 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost I think that the "Go" section could be expended a little, but the main omission is any mention of distance. I think that the introduction should say that it is a 26 mile / 45 kn trek - check these figures which I got from one of the tour operator's wwebsite. If there are any established ways of expressing te sea level equivalent distance that could also be added. AlasdairW (talk) 23:25, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
Good point about the distance—I've added that to the "Understand" section. —Granger (talk · contribs) 21:25, 26 February 2018 (UTC
Thanks for the edits. I now support it. AlasdairW (talk) 22:44, 26 February 2018 (UTC)
Okay, I'm satisfied with the fixes, and certainly don't want to stand in the way of a four-vote quorum here. Support. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 23:45, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I haven't read through the article, but I've scanned down the page. It looks about as complete as could be and I think it should be a Featured Travel Topic in the future. Selfie City (talk) 04:09, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Rail travel in the Netherlands[edit]

Place: Rail travel in the Netherlands
Blurb: Having said farewell to paper tickets several years ago, the efficient Dutch rail network may very well be the example for the future of rail travel. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any time but December, preferably around September 20th, 2019 (180th anniversary).
Edit: I understand that September 2019 may cause problems. Other dates of importance in the upcoming five years are:

  • December 2018; Sprinter Nieuwe Generatie put in service (same issue; too soon).
  • Early 2021; Intercity Nieuwe Generatie put in service.
  • In general, September is my preferred month for featuring since the anniversary of the Dutch railway network is in that month. March of 2022 is also fine by me (182½ year anniversary).
  • August 2021; 25 years since the first concession of the Dutch railways.

I am well aware that the feature date doesn't need to have a reason behind it, but I recon it might as well. Don't limit yourself to the dates above, but rather consider them.
Nominated by: Wauteurz (talk) 14:22, 21 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: The article may need some touching up here and there as most information in the article has come from me, but content-wise I believe that nothing is missing and the article is therefore a good candidate for FTT.

Nomination
NS 4000 Bovenkarspel.jpg


I should say, though, this is an exceptionally good article and I support its eventually being run as a feature. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 15:18, 21 January 2018 (UTC)
I don't think there is a problem to run Rail travel in Germany perhaps already in August 2018, especially as RtiG is a topic and not a place. In that way this could be featured in September 2019 as desired, "only" 20 months from now. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:12, 22 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support — I've noticed you working on this one over the last several months and it's looking very informative. At least at a quick glance I can't really find anything wrong with it. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:17, 22 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Minor language and possible "nerding out" issues (for which I am the wrong person to judge them) aside, there is nothing to preclude my support for this feature and thanks to Wauteurz for some amazing work. As the user who nominated rail travel in Germany, I would have no qualms moving it around if this article could then be featured on a date that fits better. Just please don't feature either in December, as that is the European schedule change. Hobbitschuster (talk) 22:52, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak Support, some essential details need finetuning - the article is thoroughly written but some of the more practical information is not entirely spot on, i.e. information about gates is too general, there is no information present about the surcharge for tickets purchased at the counter, no correct information present about the cost if you check in and check out after a certain time at the same station, information about opening train doors and onboard announcements is very specific to some of the rolling stock but wrong for others. In general, quite a large part of the article is written towards railway enthousiasts with a lot of technical details, but less towards the average tourist who travels on the train for the first time in the Netherlands. --WallyTheWalrus (talk) 23:42, 1 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Support, although there are some issues with red links. Selfie City (talk) 04:26, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Can you elaborate on 'issues with redlinks' so that I can fix it? I am aware that I've left a few (somewhere around ten) redlinks in the article, and I would assume the issue is them being linked to in the first place?
-- Wauteurz (talk) 15:29, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Rail_travel_in_the_Netherlands#Expansion_and_boom is one example, but there are several parts of the article that seem to abound in red links. Also, I'm not crazy about red-colored listings. Selfie City (talk) 22:44, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Sydney Airport[edit]

Place: Sydney Airport
Blurb: The main gateway to Australia serves flights from all inhabited continents and is the end of one of the world's busiest air routes. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Anytime
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 11:03, 28 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: In October there'll be a year since we ran Manchester Airport and it'll be possible to have another airport article on the Main Page. We have two unfeatured guide airport articles which are slightly problematic, Heathrow Airport (from the UK, just like Manchester, so people might object to two airport articles from the same country back to back) and Seattle-Tacoma International Airport (we have a ton of U.S. nominees right now). But as it looks like SYD's article "Has different choices for accommodation and eating/drinking, and information on flights, airlines and terminals. Listings and layout closely match the manual of style. There will be multiple ways to get in, some suggestions for moving out, and information on getting around.", I just upgraded that article's status to guide and hereby nominate it.

Nomination
Qantas Boeing 747-400 at Sydney airport.jpg
  • Support And as always, if anyone thinks there's anything missing, feel free to add it. ϒpsilon (talk) 11:03, 28 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak support. Is there any information about specific shops, restaurants, bars etc. to put in "Buy", "Eat", and "Drink"? (I realize that most "Eat" listings would likely consist of fast food, but I think it's more appropriate to list places like that in airport articles than in ordinary destinations.) -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:35, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
On the talk page I pinged some voyagers who I guess use the airport every now and then, and Eat was updated including some restaurants. Perhaps they have something more to add, otherwise we can always take a look at the airport's home page. --ϒpsilon (talk) 17:59, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I just made a minor edit to this article, and it looks fine for an airport article. Selfie City (talk) 02:46, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Avoiding travel through the United States[edit]

Place: Avoiding travel through the United States
Blurb: Transiting through the United States might not be worth the trouble, even for U.S. citizens. Check out our guide to see why and how to avoid it. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Anytime
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 17:19, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: This article has been a good usable for quite a while and upgrading to guide and nominating for FTT was discussed on the talk page already a year ago. A few months ago I checked up the flights (may need to be checked up again just before we run it, probably in the fall) and yesterday I added some photos so the article should be ready now.

Nomination
Visa policy of the USA.png


  • Support as nominator. ϒpsilon (talk) 17:19, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support, as I already indicated on the article's talk page. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:33, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. It would be good to update the flights shortly before the article is featured, if someone has the energy. The details of Trump's travel ban should also be brought up to date shortly before featuring. —Granger (talk · contribs) 14:19, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Weak Support. I don't find it easy to support this nomination because it doesn't exactly sound patriotic, but I think the article in general is okay for a Featured Travel Topic. However, it could do with some more general information: for example, what exactly is the "no fly list" and how do people get on it? Also, there could be more information about various legislation (old or new) about travel/immigration in the US. The travel ban is only one aspect of this. I also wonder if there are very many people who would want to avoid travel through the US. Selfie City (talk) 23:14, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. Addressing this topical issue is long overdue. K7L (talk) 14:04, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment First of all, we are not here to write patriotic travel guides, much less since most of our editor base are not Americans, much less patriotic Americans. Second of all and more to the point, I think there are still some points about the w:No fly list for example listed in the WP article that could bear mention and of course before this goes live the flights would have to be checked and rechecked. Hobbitschuster (talk) 10:32, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost. I try to avoid travelling via the US, unless it is my destination. Travelling from the UK to New Zealand, it takes about the same time via the US or Asia. However the US is much less welcoming to transit passengers than China. The article is good, but it has no advice on how to search for an "avoiding US" flight. Are there particular flight booking websites that let you specify a list of countries to avoid? AlasdairW (talk) 22:56, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment Selfie City, this article is generally speaking not intended for American citizens, but for everyone else who wants to avoid the hassle of U.S. security theater and hassles with U.S. immigration, etc. Otherwise, I'd simply agree with Hobbitschuster that this is not a site that has "touting the U.S.A." among its goals, but rather, has the traveller comes first as its prime directive. And avoiding the U.S. is definitely a good idea for loads of people around the world. Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:12, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment. Ikan Kekek and Hobbitschuster: I think there was a misunderstanding here. The beginning of my original comment didn't mean that patriotism was a reason not to include it. I was just saying that I personally found it hard to support, but I'm still going to ignore my personal bias. And I was not being completely serious in that statement. Selfie City (talk) 14:11, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/SS Lusitania[edit]

Place: Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay/SS Lusitania
Blurb: The century-old remains of this Portuguese ocean liner are seldom visited, yet are considered one of the top wreck dives in the Cape Peninsula region. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Oct-May per Diving the Cape Peninsula and False Bay#Climate, weather and sea conditions
Nominated by: AndreCarrotflower (talk) 02:19, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
Comment: The last time we were talking about dive guides on the Main Page, I remember suggesting we hold off and not run them as frequently as every year, as most of Peter Southwood's articles focus on the immediate vicinity of Cape Town, which would mean a disproportionate level of Main Page coverage would be concentrated into a very small geographical area. That's all well and good, but by next winter/spring it will have been nearly three years since we ran a dive guide - and there's certainly no denying the quality of Peter's work. Perusing the ranks of Guide-level dive guides, this one struck me as fairly interesting, and would be the first time we've ever featured a shipwreck on the Main Page.

Nomination
Porthole at SS Lusitania DSC00783.JPG


  • Support as nominator. Looks reasonably complete, with the exception of the "Photography" subsection, which consists in its entirety of a note the author left for himself: "(photographic equipment suggestions)". Perhaps Peter can fill that in for us; if not, it would seem not to be of such vital importance that we couldn't delete it or at least <!-- hide --> the parenthetical memo. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 02:19, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
Aaaaaand the above problem has already been addressed! -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 05:53, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
Yes, I was just about to come back here to say so. The article is, as you say, fairly complete and up to date. I would be happy to see it feature on the Main Page. I am also open to suggestions to improve the general appearance - layout of photos etc. • • • Peter (Southwood) (talk): 06:24, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
  • Support I also thought about nominating one of Peter's diving articles for sometime in early 2019. Speaking of Cape Town, I learned yesterday that the city has severe problems with its water reserves (also see the warning box in the article), don't know how much this affects diving travellers who probably have access to cars and boats and thus can easily eat, drink, sleep and buy supplies e.g. 200 kms away if needed. And according to Previous_Featured_travel_topics we've had dive guides as FTT in January 2013 and May 2016, so this will only be the third time. ϒpsilon (talk) 12:07, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
  • SupportGranger (talk · contribs) 12:01, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost. The "get in" section needs more information and there's a red link in it. Selfie City (talk) 13:32, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Winter in the Nordic countries[edit]

Place: Winter in the Nordic countries
Blurb: Snow, ice, winter sports, northern lights, Santa and an interesting cuisine — there are many reasons to visit the Nordic countries in the winter! (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: November, to get the most out of the article
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 17:16, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Yes, we've probably never had as many FTT nominees before as we have now, but many of them are guaranteed not to be seen on the Main Page before 2019, so how about running this one right at the threshold of the winter? We've been working on the article for a few months and while some minor polishing is still needed, I'd say the article is at guide status by now.

Nomination
Storlien ski area.JPG


  • Support --ϒpsilon (talk) 17:16, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. We're actually fully stocked with FTTs up to and including November 2018 (as Hobbitschuster said, I don't think concerns about an overabundance of U.S. destinations really apply to an article specifically about not visiting that country), but IMO it would actually be better to run this in December — it would make a nice holiday feature. Article looks complete, no complaints or issues from me. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 17:31, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
December is fine too. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:25, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
While November and December are usually terrible for winter sport (short days and little snow), articles should on principle be featured well before the desirable season. /Yvwv (talk) 19:55, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
Historically, consensus has disagreed with the above philosophy on when to feature. However, it's perhaps worth mentioning that "December" FTTs actually spend more time on the Main Page in January than in the previous month. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 20:02, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
"Well before the season" is applicable when featuring it during the season in practice would mean a prospective traveler would have to wait until the next season (e.g. the Inca trail nomination above), and this is not the case here. On the other hand, the article is not only about winter sports but also the Christmas season and the Polar night among others. December is fine, but I would rather not have it postponed until January, let alone February. ϒpsilon (talk) 20:28, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
The peak holiday for Nordic ski resorts is Easter, which in 2019 is on April 21st. A December/January slot would be prospective for skiers, and in synch with those who want to experience the polar night. /Yvwv (talk) 21:38, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
Sounds like December is a good month, then. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 03:57, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
  • SupportGranger (talk · contribs) 11:57, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Support (although I am biased...). The polar light (aurora borealis) season starts in September and lasts throughout the winter until early April. The skiing season mostly begins in December (or even later), but in some parts of Norway skiing begins in (early) November. Some ski lifts actually open in May and stay open during summer, but I guess that is a different topic. Erik den yngre (talk) 15:00, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. I can see there's a lot of useful content in this article. I think, though, I need to address some issues with this article:
  1. This article could do with fewer pictures. There are some really nice pictures but there are others that do not need to be in the article and could easily draw an article's readers attention from the article itself to the pictures.
  2. In the weather section is a chart that shows general climatic conditions. This would be more attractive if it was formatted as a table, which would help out with my first point.
  3. The weather section would probably be more accurately titled "climate".
  4. The quote in the "daylight" section doesn't add much to the article and doesn't even make much sense. I think we should either find another quote to replace it or remove the quote altogether.
  5. Due to all the red links in the ski resorts section, that section looks kind-of messy. Also, I don't think the formatting of those listings is totally consistent.
  6. The "buy" section could do with some more information, although it doesn't need to be too long for an article about a season.
  7. Because this article is really about the cold weather in Nordic countries, I think the entire "stay safe" section should be devoted to weather only, and the first part of this section and the "weather" heading should be removed. Still, in general, this is a good, detailed article that should be a Featured Travel Topic either starting late November, late December, perhaps late January, or be featured in the late 2019/early 2020 winter. Selfie City (talk) 23:28, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Indonesian phrasebook[edit]

Place: Indonesian phrasebook
Blurb: When exploring the treasures of Indonesia, especially away from the common tourist trails, you'll certainly get use for some Indonesian phrases. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 15:14, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
Comment: Time to nominate another phrasebook, I think. This seems like a complete phrasebook with pseudo-pronunciation for all phrases. And we have many users who understand Indonesian, if there are some things that need to be looked at. But I'd say the only thing the article needs are some more photos to give it some color.

Nomination
Indonesia 2016 50000r o.jpg
  • Support --ϒpsilon (talk) 15:14, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Support. Definitely. No need for debate about this one. I think we should do this one this winter, or perhaps in the spring of 2019? See Ikan Kekek's comment. Selfie City (talk) 15:16, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
We ran Italian phrasebook in February and try to have at least one year between topics of the same type so yes, winter or spring is probably when we'll feature this one. ϒpsilon (talk) 15:23, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Oppose until the issue of how to represent glottal stops in pseudo-translations on this phrasebook is resolved and the changes are thoroughly implemented (I'd like to insist on a solution for unaspirated Ts and Ps, too, but mistransliterating glottal stops is a more severe defect, IMO). I brought this up at Talk:Indonesian phrasebook#Pseudo-transliteration for glottal stops, but no action was taken on it. See Malay phrasebook#Note for an example of how to deal with glottal stops and unaspirated Ts and Ps. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:42, 22 June 2018 (UTC)
You clearly have a good understanding of the language, so I'll go neutral and leave this to an expert. Selfie City (talk) 17:39, 22 June 2018 (UTC)

[unindent] In addition, I'm noticing inconsistent psuedo-transliterations of "mau". I'd probably use "mah-oo", not "ma-oo" or "mah-hoo" or "mah-woo", but it's important for someone to knowledgeably pick one approximation and use it consistently. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:24, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

Fortunately we have several Indonesian speakers active here, so they can probably help if they have time. Pinging User:Othello95, User:Ibhi19, User:Gsarwa. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:07, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
Alright. I'm going to go with Ikan's proposal to make all pseudo-transliterations on the page to be more consistent and try to help as much as I can. Meanwhile, I found this page to guide us later for editing the pseudo-transliterations on the page. What do you think? ibhi19 (talk) 19:35, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
Great. That guide to pronunciation is very good, except that a rolled r is not like "tt" in "butter" in most English dialects. Anyway, I think that if anyone doesn't understand what "rolled r" means, there's really not much hope of them other than to learn by listening to Indonesian-speakers. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:02, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

Jazz[edit]

Place: Jazz
Blurb: Even though this music is associated with the blues, its mixture of cultural backgrounds makes it one of the liveliest and happiest music genres in the world. (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Any, although I think summer is best
Nominated by: Selfie City (talk) 21:17, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
Comment: I know this will have to wait a while, but I've been developing the article and I think it's now ready to be FTT at some point in the future. However, I do have two concerns that I can think of at the moment with this article: first, it needs a banner different from Jazz Track; second, it needs at least one more recording to demonstrate what jazz sounds like; and third, it could do with more in the venues section, which was only recently brought to a size beyond one sentence.

Nomination
Charlie Parker, Tommy Potter, Miles Davis, Duke Jordan, Max Roach (Gottlieb 06851).jpg


  • Support as nominator, especially if these changes are made. Selfie City (talk) 21:17, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
  • Almost what SC just said. There must for sure be other famous jazz venues in the US than just the four that are mentioned? ϒpsilon (talk) 20:02, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

Magellan-Elcano circumnavigation[edit]

Place: Magellan-Elcano circumnavigation
Blurb: 500 years ago five ships left Seville to go where no other European explorers had sailed before... (should not exceed ~145 characters)
Article status: Guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: Jul, Aug or Sep 2019 to celebrate the half millenium since the start of this journey
Nominated by: ϒpsilon (talk) 20:02, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
Comment: I started this little project back in 2016, already then looking to bring it up to guide status until 2019. Per a little discussion on the article's talk page, I just added the Magellan-related attractions along the route the modern day voyager can visit, and can't come to think of much else to add to the article. You can read about Magellan's journey, and there's advice for getting from place to place and what you can see at each point in the itinerary.

Nomination
Ferdinand Magellan.jpg
I think the problem described at Talk:Magellan-Elcano_circumnavigation#Verb_tenses needs fixing before it is featured. Pashley (talk) 15:13, 9 July 2018 (UTC)