User talk:SHB2000/Archive 2021

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Archives for 2021 (current) 2022

Hello, this is just an archive of my talk page. New threads get archived after 14 days of inactivity. Due to my username change in April, all threads here with my old username have been modified to have my new one. Any remaining ones will be deliberately left, either since the username is the topic issue. FYI, my old username can be deciphered by reading #Name change. So now most messages will have "SHB2000" in it, and not my old one to prevent confusion. This thread also contains messages from my IP talk page as well.


Hello, SHB2000! Welcome to Wikivoyage.

To help get you started contributing, we've created a tips for new contributors page, full of helpful links about policies and guidelines and style, as well as some important information on copyleft and basic stuff like how to edit a page. If you need help, check out Help, or post a message in the travellers' pub. New users are also welcome to post any questions or concerns to the arrivals lounge. If you want some practice editing, please do so on our graffiti wall. If you are familiar with Wikipedia, take a look over some of the differences here. If you want to contribute with information about the place where you live, see Wikivoyage:Welcome, locals.

Also I have blocked ThePikerWorm. If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask! Gizza (roam) 03:59, 26 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you so much for your kind message and blocking User:ThePikerWorm. I'll try and create as many Australian Articles as possible. SHB2000 (talk) 04:01, 26 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@DaGizza: How do I add a map to Grand Pacific Drive? Thanks, SHB2000 (talk) 04:26, 26 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Crop tool

Welcome, and thank you for your contributions. I've cropped the banner for Golden Highway. It is actually quite easy to use the Crop Tool, so you might want to try it yourself. You copy the filename of your picture from the commons, set the ratio to 7:1, then re-size the box to select the part of the picture you want to use. A new filename is created, which you can copy before hitting the Upload button. Best regards, Ground Zero (talk) 14:01, 26 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Thank you for starting the Australian Tourist Drive articles. Are you planning to expand these articles? The Grand Pacific Drive article is pretty good, but the other articles don't really provide very much information for travellers. For example, they don't explain why you'd want to drive those routes. They also don't identify what there is to see along the way. I'm not not sure what these articles really do for the reader. I am hoping to see more, as I plan to do a driving trip in Australia in the coming years, and these articles, if they are expanded could be very useful to me. Regards, Ground Zero (talk) 03:03, 30 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yes I am, when I get a little more time. Hope you have a good time here. SHB2000 (talk) 03:38, 30 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@Ground Zero: Just did a run through of Tourist Drive 33, so it's probably the next one going to be written. SHB2000 (talk) 00:44, 31 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello. Having looked at your articles, I would recommend filling out the ones you've already started before starting any more. Even the Grand Pacific Drive article doesn't have the route description, which is the most important part of an itinerary. Just look at it this way - the more time you spend on creating new stubs, the less time you've got to improve the articles you've already created. All the best, ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 09:09, 31 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks TravelAroundOz. I've added a map to Grand Pacific Drive. If you've added the wikidata links to destinations in your article, the map is generated automatically when you put this in the article: {{mapframe|zoom=8}}
You can zoom in with a bigger number or zoom out with a smaller number. Keep up the good work. Ground Zero (talk) 13:05, 31 January 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ground Zero: Hey Ground Zero, would Tourist Drive 33 still be a stub now? SHB2000 (talk) 08:42, 6 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


@DaGizza, Ground Zero:Yep, thanks. Off topic, but I've just created a template called {{Uw-vandalism2}} similar to the one on en wiki. Make for people like User:ThePikerWorm (no it's for vandals not just him). Does it need approval?
If I may: I recommend not using it. Wikivoyage policy is deny recognition. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:41, 1 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I see. Definitely, not like or commons SHB2000 (talk) 10:48, 1 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Nope. Although "deny recognition" is a Wikipedia guideline, too, it's not at all universally observed there. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:00, 1 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
TAO: With fewer active editors and fewer administrators, the Wikivoyage community has found it necessary to take much faster action with vandals. The Wikipedia approach of being gentle and encouraging them to become constructive editors doesn't work here: we usually move very quickly to shut them down. We have had to deal with several very persistent vandals who are clever at exploiting the system, so we block very quickly, and hide their vandalism from view to discourage them. Regards, Ground Zero (talk) 12:59, 1 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I see. Definitely different from en wiki. SHB2000 (talk) 06:05, 2 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

[Outdent] Further on templates: Before you make loads and loads of templates, please read Wikivoyage:Using MediaWiki templates#New MediaWiki template proposals:

Before a new MediaWiki template is put into general use it needs to be discussed and accepted as good or preferably best practice. Until such acceptance, new templates will be tagged {{experimental}}, and should not be added to more than one low-visibility article—so not Paris. (If other editors object to that addition, though, expect it to be removed until a consensus is reached.) If new templates fail to gain community support, they will eventually be deleted.[etc.]

And what are you doing, redirecting your user talk page? I've never seen this done before, and it strikes me as hostile to all other users and smacks of vandalism to me. I would urge you to put this back into your standard user talk page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:05, 12 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hey TAO, I restored my edits on this article. Wikivoyage, like other travel guides, tries to use a consistent style for formatting times and dates, phone numbers, prices, and do on. It makes it easier for the reader to find information quickly. Using a variety of styles, as the article did before I cleaned it up, makes it looks sloppy and unreliable. Wv:tdf sets out one style for countries that use the 24-hour clock (e.g., 09:00-17:00), and one style for countries that use the 12-hour clock (e.g., 9AM-5PM). A destination article should never use both formats, as this one did — it's more confusing for the reader. The talk page for each country article identifies the style we use for that country's articles in a box at the top of the page.

If you disagree with Wikivoyage style, or with the style selected for any country, you can propose changes on the appropriate talk page.

Also, the edits you undid included a bunch of capitalisation, grammar, punctuation and formatting corrections. I have restored the lot of them. Regards, Ground Zero (talk) 01:59, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Whoops, sorry about that. But which page do I go to? SHB2000 (talk) 02:05, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
As well as that, would Tourist Drive 33 still be a stub now or an outline. SHB2000 (talk) 02:06, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You restored a mix of formatting styles, so I'm not really clear what it is you are trying to do. If you disagree with Wikivoyage time formatting, raise it at Wikivoyage talk:Time and date formats. If you think we should use the 24-hour format in Aus articles, raise it at Talk:Australia. Ground Zero (talk) 03:05, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, I'm saying we should use 24hr time in Aussie articles. But would TD33 be a stub now? SHB2000 (talk) 03:07, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I have upgraded Torist Drive 33 to "outline". I think it would be "usable" if each of the places under "Drive" had a short description. Ground Zero (talk) 03:09, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Cheers mate, I'll do it in the next 3 days. SHB2000 (talk) 03:11, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ground Zero: All of the places under "drive" now have a description and as such, would it now be usable. SHB2000 (talk) 08:33, 7 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi again.

Thanks for your efforts with sending welcome messages, but would you mind leaving that to other users until you get more experience editing? Part of the purpose of such messages is for the new user to have someone to contact if they need any help but don't know how to use or aren't aware other resources like article talk pages, the Pub, Arrivals lounge etc. In this event, it's best for the person who helps them to have at least a few months' experience, otherwise it's likely they won't know the best way to help. There's also no point welcoming users with no editing history on Wikivoyage; we normally wait until either a person has made several edits or until one of their edits requires discussion. You can see a user's contributions by looking in the left sidebar on their user page, or else by searching Special/Contribution:username.

Finally, remember that whenever you post on a talk page, it's important to sign your post by typing four tildes in a row like this: ~~~~. You'd think after 20 years, the Wikimedia Foundation would have devised a way for talk page posts to sign automatically on desktop mode, but unfortunately they haven't.

Any questions, don't hesitate to ask. The tourist drives are coming together nicely.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 11:21, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sure mate SHB2000 (talk) 11:24, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also hard to believe 20 years. SHB2000 (talk) 11:28, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ikr. I don't think I was aware of Wikipedia till about 2006.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 11:32, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also, I'm a bit confused on what to name Alternate Tourist Drive 24. Should I put "(Queensland)" in brackets or not? Not many people will know where it is, unlike 33.
If there's another road called Alternate Tourist Drive 24 somewhere else in the world, then yes add "(Queensland)". But if not, it doesn't matter how obscure the route is, it doesn't need disambiguating.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 11:56, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The thing is, I don't know. Tourist Drives are so poorly maintained in all states except NSW, QLD and WA. One thing for sure is that all WA tourist drives are covered on enwiki. Nothing about NSW or QLD. I also don't know about anything in Victoria as it's so poorly maintained that even the signs lead to nowhere there. SHB2000 (talk) 12:05, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Fair enough. In that case, maybe just assume there isn't another one, as it's quite a specific name. If in the future someone wants to create an article for another unknown "Alternate Tourist Drive 24", a disambiguation can be created then.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:08, 8 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Aggressive archiving

Why are you archiving a 7-day-old post in Talk:Sydney? Ikan Kekek (talk) 16:38, 14 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Well Ikan, it isn't a post to question but to just tell you guys about the change. [[[User:SHB2000|SHB2000]] (talk) 07:50, 15 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Didn't I reply to this? 7 days is way too short to even expect people to see a post. I urge you to wait at least 2-3 months before archiving anything. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Thanks for the Aussie barn compass. Australia is high on my list of places to visit when the world gets back to normal. If you haven't seen this already, I think it would be useful for you: Wikivoyage:Itinerary status shows the criteria for upgrading itinerary articles from stub to outline to usable to guide. Happy editing. Ground Zero (talk) 14:22, 15 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks mate. I'll just have to wait till we get the Traveloca thing sorted out. SHB2000 (talk)02:50, 16 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ground Zero: Additionally, are there too much images on Tourist Drive 33 or is it just fine. SHB2000 (talk) 04:11, 16 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Wikivoyage:Image policy says:
"Short articles (less than 3,000 bytes) should usually have no more than 1–2 images, including a map. For longer articles, 1 image per screen (1,000–2,000 bytes) is generally adequate."
You're easily within that guideline. I think it looks fine. Ground Zero (talk) 13:03, 16 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ground Zero: I guess I can have 18ish images since the article is 18k+ bytes. Cheers though, SHB2000 (talk) 11:27, 18 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'd read that as 9-18, but 18 sounds like a lot of images. I don't think that would get advisable. We don't want our articles to burn through readers' mobile data. Ground Zero (talk) 12:17, 18 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I don't think I even have 12 images. SHB2000 (talk) 20:18, 18 February 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

There are 9 including the banner 08:44, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Might add a tenth one. SHB2000 (talk) - 10:02, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Name change

Note: This section has my old username for those that are curious. It has been deliberately been left, as the topic is about the username.

Hey, TravelAroundOz (or SHB2000 now). Was just checking w:WP:PERM over at Wikipedia and a little surprised to see you there instead of here. I just noticed the name change -- any particular reason? Just friendly curiosity, hope you're doing well and it wasn't about anything bad. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 07:54, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

So it doesn't get confused with this person, in this case who I amn't. SHB2000 (talk) 08:33, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And now I edit both WP and WV. SHB2000 (talk) 08:33, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Are you ever planning to change your name back? 09:04, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Nope. SHB2000 (talk) 09:06, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

April Fools suggestions page

Hi, I pinged you to this page, however since you changed your name literally less than an hour ago, I don't know if the ping reached you. 08:42, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi, I did receive the ping but I was editing Tourist Drive 30 at the time SHB2000 (talk) 08:45, 13 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Tourist Drive 1

Hi, SHB2000. It looks like I created a problem, since I didn't wait long enough to hear from you about whether you were going to create more Tourist Drive 1 articles and moved the one in Central New South Wales to just Tourist Drive 1. There are a bunch of roads with the same name in different Australian states, then? It looks like I need to revert that name change and just spell out New South Wales because we don't use abbreviations for states on this site as a matter of style and because we don't expect people from outside a given country to know such abbreviations. Sorry about that. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:49, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I see you fixed the problem. Thanks, and sorry again for ignorantly changing the name. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:51, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Though thanks for alerting me about the name issue. By the way, there are 5 Tourist Drive 1's I know of, with three in New South Wales SHB2000 (talk) 06:53, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I guess that's somewhat similar to how we could have the same numbering for an interstate highway, a federal road, a state road and a county road in any given U.S. state. We don't have roads specifically called tourist roads, though, as far as I know. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:58, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No, that's an Aussie thing. Infact, Australia still has 8 different numbering systems similar to the US system


  • National Highway
  • National Route
  • State Route
  • Metroads (even though there are only two remaining)
  • Alphanumeric (similar to Europe)
  • National Highway Alphanumeric
  • Tourist Drive/Ways
  • Detour route (note that whoever edited w:Highways in Australia must've assumed its an alphanumeric even though it really isn't.

But surely there'd be strategic tourist routes in the US (unsigned, just information maps) SHB2000 (talk) 09:35, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

There are scenic routes, though they're usually numbered like any other and just marked with extra dotted lines on paper maps, for anyone who still uses those. I can think of one private road that has beautiful scenery and charges a toll, though. It's called the 17-Mile Drive and it's in Carmel, California. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:45, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Why charge a toll on a scenic road??? SHB2000 (talk) 10:10, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Because they can. :-) But I mentioned it because that's exceptional. Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:07, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Man, I should stop complaining about the toll in Toowoomba, a regional city. This is just a road while that's a motorway ;) SHB2000 (talk) 20:12, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

An award for you

Barncompass.png The Wikivoyage Barncompass
For your general contributions to Wikivoyage, and specifically for your work on Australia articles. We're glad you're here, mate. Ground Zero (talk) 12:39, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Cheers mate, and yes I am hoping to create an article for every major tourist drive in Australia. Just passed my 1000th edit :) SHB2000 (talk) 20:13, 18 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Road travel between Adelaide/Melbourne -- itinerary potential?

Dropping in a word on your talk page, because you definitely have a lot more experience with the road articles than me. Do you think there's any solid potential for an article on overland travel (possibly including the bus and train routes as well as driving) between Adelaide-Melbourne, and would you be interested in helping out on one? I know it's a bit outside your usual geographic remit, but it's a trip I make regularly and I've been floating the idea of writing on it. Some of the closer-together capital cities, especially for ones outside the southeast bubble, so in my experience road trips and train/bus travel is fairly common. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

On a side note I'm actually terrible with roads, and my knowledge to contributing is past experience on those roads on those guides or travel guides/brochures. But Yes, we could make Adelaide-Melbourne by car. SHB2000 (talk) 05:44, 19 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also a reason why I rarely edit WA/NT/Tas related itinerary articles SHB2000 (talk) 05:49, 19 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── @Vaticidalprophet: also note I'm happy to edit outside of NSW like with Strzelecki Track. SHB2000 (talk) 11:22, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

"Do not be an irresponsible person"

I don't think we should include that scolding tone in any warnings. IMO, let's just give readers information and trust that they won't be idiots, or that if they are, scolding all readers will if anything produce the opposite effect in them. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:50, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sure, will fix it up. SHB2000 (talk) 05:18, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks a lot. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:25, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


G'day SHB, thankfully we haven't been hit that hard. But I appreciate you asking. There have been a few small leaks of water that have gotten inside the home and the back and frontyards are drenched. Hope you are staying safe and dry. What a crazy time the last couple of years have been. First the bushfires/drought, then Covid and now the floods (and of course Covid still isn't over yet). Gizza (roam) 07:03, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Oy! I didn't realize you were in Australia. I wish you the best. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:15, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Agree. First the strawberries, then the drought, then bushfires, then COVID now floods. SHB2000 (talk) 07:19, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I was fortunate enough to get this, this and this SHB2000 (talk) 07:21, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ikan Kekek:, Yes, DaGizza is the only other editor I know who lives in Sydney. SHB2000 (talk) 08:15, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

16:53, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

An award for you

Sydney Opera House, botanic gardens 1.jpg The Aussie Wikivoyage Barncompass
Thanks for your great work on improving Australian travel pages, especially driving articles. Hope Tourist Drive 33 gets star status soon! --LivelyRatification (talk) 02:58, 23 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks so much. I wish the same for Stratford (Victoria) as well. SHB2000 (talk) 05:16, 23 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Outline vs. stub

Hi. Outlines have a template, regardless of whether they have content. Stubs don't have a template. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:47, 24 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Okay, I'll take that for next time as I was unaware of that. It's rather weird how it works as generally outlines are meant to give more information to the reader but it's weird when it comes to Great Alpine Road (incomplete) and these useless articles written by User:EnglishEP (translated) haven't even been modified. Anyway, have a good day and stay safe. Thanks, SHB2000 (talk) 08:34, 24 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You too. How's the flooding now? Ikan Kekek (talk) 17:31, 24 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
All gone, was a 32˚ day yesterday. SHB2000 (talk) 20:14, 24 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

17:31, 29 March 2021 (UTC)

Usernames followed by 2-3 numbers

These are socks of the Telstra guy at least 80% of the time, so best not to waste time posting to their user talk pages. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:26, 31 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That Brendon John Williams guy? Out of curiosity, how'd you find out his real name? SHB2000 (talk) 10:28, 31 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Wait never mind, his original usernane was it. SHB2000 (talk) 10:31, 31 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@Ikan Kekek:, would Slimmil689 be one? SHB2000 (talk) 10:48, 31 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yep. Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:43, 31 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I see it's a vandalism only account. SHB2000 (talk) 03:32, 1 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Your revert

You reverted my edit to Innamincka with the edit comment "exception. see the pub for discussion". I don't see it over there. Please explain. --FredTC (talk) 22:21, 3 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

See [10] SHB2000 (talk) 05:29, 4 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikidata weekly summary #462

Welcoming new users again

Again, thanks for participating in this. However, Rodolfo2083‎‎ has no contributions, and that username suggests a likelihood of possibly being another sockpuppet of the Telstra guy. I'd suggest waiting a least a couple of posts before welcoming anyone. Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:02, 8 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sorry for the late response, I've been out since Tuesday and now have my space key fixed. Thought the telstra guy's sock's are only 2-3 digits. Though I suppose he'd slowly start to change his editing habits/usernames. SHB2000 (talk) 09:53, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But in any case, there's generally no point in welcoming someone who hasn't even made a single edit. The only time I do that is when their username suggests they are tour agency owners or something, and even then, preemptive advice not to tout or violate other Wikivoyage guidelines is almost never successful. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:31, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi there. Wikivoyage:Naming_conventions#Disambiguation states that "one place is so much more famous than others with the same name" shouldn't be disambiguated. I would say this is probably the case with Vaucluse (France), especially since Vaucluse (New South Wales) doesn't even have an article, and possibly never will, given that it's covered by Sydney/Eastern Suburbs. I'd therefore like to revert your page move.

If there's a chance that the Vaucluse in NSW will get an article one day, or if you're planning to make one, then the disambig page can be transferred to Vaucluse (disambiguation). What do you think? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:40, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sure. Vaucluse (New South Wales) is unlikely to get its own page for the next four years. Feel free to revert the move. SHB2000 (talk) 12:43, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@ThunderingTyphoons!:, somethings preventing me from moving Vaucluse (France) to Vaucluse. SHB2000 (talk) 12:48, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No worries, I've done it. The Vaucluse page needed to be deleted in order to overwrite it.
Is there some significance to "the next four years" with regard to Vaucluse, NSW?--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:54, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The Eastern Suburbs will probably be too big for its own article and need to be broken down into smaller sections. La Perouse (can NSW have more french names) is sort of an exception as you can't fit all of what's there into the Eastern Suburbs article. SHB2000 (talk) 12:56, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Looking at a Greater Sydney rail map (yes, I collect train maps of places I'll probably never visit, don't judge me), I'm always struck by the number of place names borrowed seemingly at random from unremarkable towns in and around London - Bexley, Stanmore, Croydon, Lewisham, Richmond... - and wonder how they stack up against the originals.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 13:26, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Agree, it's only the last 20 years where names have been changing to indigenous names. Some hard to pronounce ones as well like Oodnadatta, Kununurra, Wooloomooloo, Kiwirakurra. There's also a bunch of other UK names in NSW like Liverpool, Cardiff (yes, when someone says cardiff, i think of cardiff, nsw and not cardiff, wales), Gloucester, Forster, Goulburn, Griffith, Camden (the origin of our Griffith is from Burley Griffin and not from the UK Griffith), Bathurst, Windsor and to say, there's a lot more than what I've mentioned. SHB2000 (talk) 21:45, 9 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

19:41, 5 April 2021 (UTC)

@Ikan Kekek, Mx. Granger,, Vaticidalprophet, ThunderingTyphoons!, Ground Zero, LPfi: - Re. the pub and the dates, The tech update that I received a week ago. SHB2000 (talk) 23:17, 10 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That’s not what I meant. What I meant was whenever I update a template, it replaces subst:#time:Y-m-d with 2021-04-11 or whatever the date is. 16:19, 11 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This Month in GLAM: March 2021

This Month in GLAM logo 2018.png

Read this edition in fullSingle-page

To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

A barncompass for you!

Sydney Opera House, botanic gardens 1.jpg The Aussie Wikivoyage Barncompass
This Barncompass is to show appreciation for your great work on Aussie articles on Wikivoyage. -- 11:46, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You gave me one so I thought I’d return the favour. :) 11:46, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks at lot. Really appreciate this. My third barncompass. SHB2000 (talk) 11:48, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You’re welcome! Enjoy the rest of your day! 11:51, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yeah, I better go and sleep soon. It's currently 21.53 here. SHB2000 (talk) 11:53, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oh, ok. Goodnight then! 11:56, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And good afternoon to you. Been waiting 3 mins to post this :) SHB2000 (talk) 12:00, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Until I realised just now that daylight savings has begun. SHB2000 (talk) 12:00, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yeah, it’s 13:05 now. 12:05, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Our clocks have just gone back an hour now :) SHB2000 (talk) 12:06, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── I thought you were going to bed now. 13:00, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'm a person who doesn't go to bed til 2300h. SHB2000 (talk) 00:17, 13 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I see. 07:48, 13 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
or even 2330h. SHB2000 (talk) 07:49, 13 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


You forgot to change the date. I changed it for you. 13:18, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, I’m not used to editing on mobile so it’s easy to forget. Take care SHB2000 (talk) 13:27, 12 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thank you! 07:46, 13 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikidata weekly summary #463

2 maps in an article?

Swept in from the pub

Hi everyone,

This might seem very odd but am I allowed to have two maps in Innamincka. One's for the 1.5km long town centre and the other is for the vast Innamincka. The problem is, they're either too close to each other or too far. Solution: A controversial request for two maps.

Is it okay?

Thanks, SHB2000 (talk) 04:46, 28 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Since these are dynamic maps, that's probably not necessary. You can pick a kind of compromise zoom level and let readers click the map to zoom in or out for more location info. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:18, 28 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000, have you considered a rectangular map? WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:31, 28 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
WhatamIdoing, how do you do that? SHB2000 (talk) 05:28, 29 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Like this, if you want the default/auto-zoom approach. Since you have one marker in a different town, you may want to put a location and/or zoom level back in. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:48, 29 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I feel like in this case a "compromise" in zoom level would leave both purposes unsatisfied. I use two maps where necessary; see, for example, Niagara Falls (New York). Powers (talk) 02:20, 30 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I would probably add the latitude, longitude and zoom parameters for the mapframe to center map and zoom in on the main area. You can use the width and height parameters to make the dynamic map into a rectangle if so desired. Two maps are probably acceptable but I think one map would suffice. Best wishes! -- Matroc (talk) 05:20, 30 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks guys, I've decided to remove the second map and incorporate both Ikan Kekek's and WhatamIdoing's ideas. Considering that for it to be a proper guide, it'll need 4 maps. (Town centre, greater Innamincka, Birdsville and Moomba) SHB2000 (talk) 09:09, 30 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Facebook pages

I agree with your edit here, but only because the hotel has its own website. If a business has no website but has its own Facebook page, we link it. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:38, 14 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@Ikan Kekek: I've done that before. Can't remember which article though. By the way, done wikivoyage have it's own insta page? SHB2000 (talk) 05:46, 14 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I doubt it. Commons is the Wiki with the photos, but I'm guessing there's no Wiki with an Instagram page. I could be wrong, though. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:42, 14 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Checking it, there's only bn and ru pages. Plus wikitravel. SHB2000 (talk) 06:44, 14 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Unilateral policy changes

Making a policy change without discussion and implementing it across a bunch of articles is always a bad idea. I'm sure that you believe you're right — and you very well may be right — but the approach you've taken does kind of say to everyone else that any views they may have on the subject are irrelevant, which leaves a bad taste.

I know you mean well, and you are a very constructive contributor. That is why I am addressing this to you on your talk page. Ground Zero (talk) 00:14, 15 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


When using text from Wikipedia, I've been following the advice at Wikivoyage:Cooperating with Wikipedia, I.d.,

"When copying text from Wikipedia (or any other CC-SA site) you must provide attribution to the original authors. Attribution is generally provided by pasting the URL for the source article version (see below) into the "edit summary" box, and/or you can use the Wikipedia template."

I've been pasting the URL into the edit summary box. The way I read the passage above, this is sufficient. Also using the Wikipedia template is fine to do, but I don't think it is necessary under the policy. Do you disagree? Ground Zero (talk) 01:02, 16 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Just incase. I mean, there's no harm in not doing it but I'll do it otherwise what's the purpose of the template. SHB2000 (talk) 05:09, 16 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Admins' watchlists

What do you mean by "'I would expect admins, at least, to monitor this page.' - But no, only a non admin is monitoring this page"? The page is on the list of pages admins are explicitly asked to monitor, and several admins have commented on the thread above your comment. I haven't commented in the thread as I have little to say for the moment. (Except that: You can disable e-mail from named users, if that's any help.) –LPfi (talk) 06:18, 16 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Very sorry about ignoring the rest of all the admins. As User:Ikan Kekek said, it's frustrating being constantly attacked. Btw, thanks for the suggestion. I only haven't disabled it incase if User: chooses to create an account one day. SHB2000 (talk) 06:45, 16 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I think there is a value in being able to send and receive e-mail. The preferences item I suggested allows disabling e-mail from a certain user (or a list of users). It does not help against somebody creating new accounts all the time, and non-logged in users cannot send wikimail anyhow. –LPfi (talk) 05:50, 17 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Additionally, I'm not going to disable it because for the 98% of good faith users, I'm not going to ruin it for them because of the 2% minority that ruins and destroys Wikimedia Projects. By disabling it, I'm just letting the vandal/harasser win. SHB2000 (talk) 12:43, 17 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Edit summary

I think your edit summary here was a bit careless, as you shouldn't want everybody watching latest changes reading that. No problem this time, and I see you changed it for the next test. –LPfi (talk) 08:21, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yeah, I didn't want someone to think that it was someone impersonating me. SHB2000 (talk) 08:24, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
OK, but telling what you were testing, when what is in there is a secret, is problematic. –LPfi (talk) 08:31, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Okay. But why is it a secret? SHB2000 (talk) 08:36, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If it weren't, they wouldn't be hidden for non-admins. They are never perfect, and if you know what they catch, they are easier to evade. –LPfi (talk) 08:56, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I see. And re reading this, I don't know how I'd've reacted when I saw this in RC. SHB2000 (talk | contribs) 08:58, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And out of curiosity, do you know what had wrote on my talk page? SHB2000 (talk | contribs) 09:00, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
This was also careless and not very kind. Please remember that everyone deserves respect. If everything Antandrus claimed is true, then through no fault of their own mental illness has completely ruined that person's life and has also caused them to inflict a lot of pain on other people.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 11:06, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes. That was the prime concern of a friend of mine when I told about the situation. She was worried that he doesn't get the support he would need from the local society – which probably is true, but something we cannot do much about. There are things we have to do here for our readers and to protect ourselves, but let's try not to make it any worse than needed.
SHB2000: I can read what he wrote, at least one message. I suppose you got more or less the same message by e-mail.
LPfi (talk) 18:24, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, in his emails, he said he doesn't have mental health issues, (email me for a copy of that email) and the revision got deleted so I can't access it. SHB2000 (talk | contribs) 22:07, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Plus, "to have no life" is a common Australian slang used for someone who frequently does stupid things. I should reduce my use of slangs. SHB2000 (talk | contribs) 22:09, 18 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikidata weekly summary #464

Is it okay if I create two armchair travel articles?

Swept in from the pub

Hi everyone,

Just wanted to ask your opinion on creating two armchair articles. Strzelecki Track and Birdsville Track. They can be physically accessed but with one vehicle every 2-3 days. Just wanting to ask whether I should create it based on if a traveller goes and explores it or for armchair travel?

Cheers, SHB2000 (talk) 11:34, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'd say cover these as itineraries, but what would be the difference in your coverage if it was meant solely for vicarious reading, which is what I think you mean by armchair travel, than if you simply cover it as a practical itinerary? Ikan Kekek (talk) 18:57, 21 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'd generally put a lot of humour in armchair travel and be a bit more serious in practical itineraries. SHB2000 (talk) 05:18, 22 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You mean kind of like a joke article? A bit of humor is fine, but if the trip is doable, I'd say don't make a joke of it. You might look at some of the articles linked in Next-to-impossible destinations. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:22, 22 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I might use Ashmore and Cartier Islands as a guide. It is doable, it's just that I don't think anyone will actually use this alone. SHB2000 (talk) 10:57, 22 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I think your article is looking good so far. Maybe the Ashmore and Cartier Island article reads like a joke because it's not written very well and has no information about why someone might want to visit, talks about what isn't there instead of what is, and is even a bit fuzzy on basic accessibility (It would really benefit from adding information provided by the Australian government. I'd suggest not trying to emulate that article. The Track and the few locations along it seem to have some history, so it shouldn't be too fill out as a legitimate travel article. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 14:41, 22 March 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

16:49, 19 April 2021 (UTC)

Page protection

I've semi-protected your page (autoconfirmed only) for one week. Please let me know if you'd like it to be lifted before the week has expired, but I'd be reluctant to do so for the remainder of today.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 10:25, 20 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks for protecting my talk page. Hopefully this guy shall stop (changed my email address as well) but this doesn't seem like its going to stop for another week. I really don't see why a non autoconfirmed user would have a reason to post here apart from User: May also want to protect Vat's talk page as well. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:28, 20 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Besen-201020053720.jpg Sweepers' Club Membership Certificate
Thanks for helping sweep old conversations off to relevant talk pages. Like housework, it's often best to do a little every day or every week, but we'd let the page get out of hand. Thanks for helping with the "spring cleaning". WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:38, 20 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks a lot. This makes my day :) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:21, 20 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@WhatamIdoing:, just did my autumn clean (but cleared the same amount of stuff as a spring clean). SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 05:34, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Is it called "autumn cleaning" in Australia? I've only ever heard "spring cleaning", and I didn't know whether the concept translated. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:16, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, it's autumn here. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:05, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Your comment

See User talk:SHB2000/Archive 2021#Edit summary about discussing certain ideas. –LPfi (talk) 09:55, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I understand you'd like to be part of the solution, but certain things lose their magic when called by name. –LPfi (talk) 09:56, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Anyway, I'll be stepping back from janitorial work for another 2 weeks. (Have other things - non wiki related to do) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:50, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
OK. Thanks for what you have been (and hopefully will be) doing. Just best to keep some things to oneself, or trusted channels. The less those whose edits we don't want know about how we find them, the better. And some of them may be following any on-wiki discussion. –LPfi (talk) 12:47, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also, I'll be adding a button similar to the trout button on wikipedia for my overuse of slangs (and other stuff too). SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:49, 21 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Please don't talk in public about how our abuse filters work. The less trolls, vandals etc. know about them, the better, and whenever you say anything about the filters in public, some of them may be listening. I think this is the third time I am trying to tell this to you. If there is something unclear about it, do ask, but i don't want to have to keep saying this. –LPfi (talk) 22:08, 22 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The Signpost: 25 April 2021

News, reports and features from the English Wikipedia's weekly journal about Wikipedia and Wikimedia

This Month in Education: April 2021

This Month in Education

Volume 10 • Issue 4 • April 2021


In This Issuse

This Month in Education: April 2021

This Month in Education

Volume 10 • Issue 4 • April 2021


In This Issuse

Wikidata weekly summary #465

21:25, 26 April 2021 (UTC)


I hope your break goes well. I look forward to seeing you again later in May. Ground Zero (talk) 11:04, 24 April 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@Ground Zero:, Thanks for the message. While I did look at this message before I left, I didn't have time to respond to it. I'm now back, a few days early, seeing the internet almost after a week. Almost forgot how to use my computer and it certainly feels different using it again. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:13, 1 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Towns vs. Cities in the UK

The definition of a city is weird in the UK. It is a large town, sometimes with a cathedral. However there is also the City of London, built on the site of the Roman town Londinium. So it is normally one of three things:

  • A town with a large cathedral
  • An old Roman town
  • A large town

Hope this helps 13:19, 3 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It aye confusin'. The definition of town is weird here (i.e. Adelaide being called a country town) but those have now been only used colloquially. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:21, 3 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Rainbow trout transparent.png Whack!

You've been whacked with a wet trout for using too much Aussie slang

Don't take this too seriously. Someone just wants to let you know you've been using too much slang 13:22, 3 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'm assuming "it aye confusin" is Aussie slang. :) 13:23, 3 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes it is. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:24, 3 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

15:43, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #466

Thank you for ...

...nominating me for administrator. I just looked around for a place to leave some kind of closing statement, but maybe there isn't one? Maybe here. I promise not to break anything. :) I have a hunch there may be a bit less trouble now; the obsessed individual tends to go where he is less likely to be recognized. But I will help with any tasks where I can assist. -- Anyway, I just got back from a hiking trip and am about to go on another one. Will look at adminny stuff in a bit. All the best -- Antandrus (talk) 14:25, 5 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, Wikivoyage will greatly benefit. And I can tell our californian articles will improve. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:23, 5 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
By the way, do you hike out at Arizona or the US east coast or somewhere not in North America? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:31, 6 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And finally, enjoy your time being an admin here. Could you also protect my enwiki talk page? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:35, 6 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Antandrus:, and while now GRP will start calling me a sockpuppet, it's all worth it. You definitely deserve to be an admin, and I hope everything's going good for you in California. Is mandatory masks a thing there? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:26, 6 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Indoors, yes - but it's now pretty much optional outdoors. I've been climbing in the mountains a lot and people aren't wearing masks much. Most of us are vaccinated now. I just bought my first plane tickets since before the pandemic. Time to get out again.
FYI, there's another LTA active - w:WP:LTA/Wikinger - he imitates GRP all the time. Often when GRP is being disruptive, Wikinger shows up to make it worse if he can. There are a couple reliable ways to tell them apart that I won't divulge publicly, but it doesn't really matter since they're both WMF-banned. "All vandals are the same vandal" can be kind of a useful philosophy. Antandrus (talk) 14:29, 6 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm well aware of Wikinger, although he's not on WV from what I can tell. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:16, 6 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wearing pink pants

Huh? I'm guessing this is one of those dead letters that's still on the books but never enforced. If so, we shouldn't include it in a serious article. Ikan Kekek (talk) 21:34, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I agree. If it's is intended as an amusing side note, it should be identified as such, or left out. Ground Zero (talk) 22:01, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It was an old law but yes it was enforced, I learnt it when I was studying law. Still a law that's still in force today but no one really pings or is nitpicky on this law anymore. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 06:18, 10 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

15:10, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: April 2021

This Month in GLAM logo 2018.png

Read this edition in fullSingle-page

To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

Travel Rant..

Thanks for the additions..

You plan to look over some of the pre-existing ones as well? ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 08:05, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Already looked at them. A few quotes that my mates have said when going to the outback. Classic Aussie - especially with the unnecessary f bombs in them. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:07, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I've also been told by some Australian visitors in London to NEVER order certain 'export' brands of alcoholic beverage if I ever visit Sydney. Perhaps this is something that could be looked into as advice for some articles? ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 08:24, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No one in my family drinks so I don't know about alcoholic beverages. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:26, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
"I've also been told by some Australian visitors in London to NEVER order certain 'export' brands of alcoholic beverage if I ever visit Sydney" -- would that be Foster's? Sounds like it might be. It's what the rest of the world thinks Australians drink, not what we actually do. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 08:42, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
possibly, although everyone in sydney (that i know) drinks vittoria beer, corona, or a champagne (more females) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:45, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Star Wars tourism

Why did you revert my edit. By doing so, information that was correct is now incorrect. The edit was not done by Brendan John Williams, but it was the only edit on Wikivoyage by Folley5851. Asked by: FredTC (talk) 06:52, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Brendo creates sock accounts - and 99% of the accounts ending in 2-4 numbers are his. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 06:53, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
By the way, Brendan John Williams is just Telstra - which I call brendo. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 06:54, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But why do you make correct information incorrect??? --FredTC (talk) 06:57, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Block evasion is block evasion: but this is more ban evasion SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:00, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
A bit of discretion is needed when dealing with the Telstra guy. Most of his edits are very poor quality or factually incorrect and should be reverted on sight, but on the odd occasion he contributes something positive to an article, it's better to keep it, particularly when a third user (in this case FredTC) has confirmed the edit was good. Whether we revert or not has no effect on Telstra's behaviour, so we might as well benefit from his occasional moments of brilliance.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 09:05, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The easy way I use to identify his edits non-username related is it almost certainly is just an added listing. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:13, 14 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

13:50, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

Growth Newsletter #18

15:23, 17 May 2021 (UTC)


I am not too enthusiastic over your welcoming Frigley after one edit about Sharpeville, which in lights of the Sharpeville massacre seems rather, uhm, biased. I think one should wait with welcoming until a user has made clearly good faith edits. –LPfi (talk) 12:35, 18 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sure, I'll keep that in mind. Forgot NPOV isn't a thing here. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:38, 18 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You mean with NPOV we would mention the convicted people, ignoring the well-known massacre? One could argue that from the point of History of Justice the conviction process was more important than the event, but the user did nothing to put the listing in such context. Also, I suppose the edit was by a long time acquaintance of ours, using a throw-away account as usual.
LPfi (talk) 13:13, 18 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Rainbow trout transparent.png Whack!

You've been whacked with a wet barra (barramundi) for using too much Aussie slang

Don't take this too seriously. FredTC just wants to let you know you've been using too much slang

This slang is not very helpfull for travelers who know Woolworths by name/experience but who are not native Australians. --FredTC (talk) 09:59, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@FredTC: - I changed it as:
1. That's what comes up in their ads
2. Locals tend to always say woolies, and saying woolworths just makes you a target, especially in the not so safe city of Casino.
SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:03, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

East Antarctica flights

I hope you could elaborate on this. "A bunch of" is not really helpful, and could be misinterpreted. Several planes every now and then? I doubt. While we want lively writing, information on getting in should be to the point. What I can see there is no information on these planes in Antarctica#Get in or East Antarctica (which refers to the former). –LPfi (talk) 10:45, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I know certain airlines have flights from Hobart. can't remember which ones though. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:54, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Could you please try to find some information, or reword not to promise too much. –LPfi (talk) 10:55, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
First thing tomorrow morning. (ACST) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:57, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks! –LPfi (talk) 12:11, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
See ya' tomorrow (click the slang button if you think this is slang). Will need to get some sleep in me. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:14, 21 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@LPfi:, oops, I was meant to respond to this last week, but I totally forgot. Sorry about that. But there are some Qantas flights, although not many. Most are chartered but some are not. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:56, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I think Ikan Kekek was referring to me there. I was going back in to soften my comment anyway. I don't wish to squabble with him (or anyone). Responding to a comment like that immediately is not a good idea. I should have take more time to consider my response. Regards, Ground Zero (talk) 10:53, 22 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I thought it was me, as a similar comment on Talk:Frankenstein but towards me. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:04, 22 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You mean the idea that no travel topics are legitimate articles? That was my reading of SHB2000's comments, not yours. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:02, 22 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ikan Kekek: Thank you for clarifying. Ground Zero (talk) 21:05, 22 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
When did I say it's not a legit article? Yes, they are, but I was referring to real destinations, which have a lot more meaning. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 00:15, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Please don't use real names of other people. User names and designations used on Meta or en-wp, such as "GRP" are OK if you need to clarify. Often that clarification is indeed not needed. Real names should be treated as confidential unless a user has added it to their user page themselves (and not removed it later), or it is in clearly widespread friendly use (such as some calling names used among regulars). Sometimes a connection might have to be called out, but it seldom needs to be done publicly.

In a general discussion about how to handle LTA, and what tools would help in that context, there is usually no need to specify individuals. Those participating in the discussion usually have enough experience to know the patterns, either from elsewhere or because they have dealt with them here lately. In most discussions among regulars, we very well know whom we are talking about without mentioning any names.

LPfi (talk) 11:14, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

So would BJW be an example of not outing, since it was Telstra's original username.
Also with GRP, one, in one of his harassment emails, he sent his name, and two, have a look at this edit on Wikisource. I've had a look at Antandrus' contributions in all english wikimedia projects, except Wikispecies. Since he's also bad-mouthed me on a couple of websites, attacking me, and continually spams my old email, which I don't use anymore. In some of his vandalistic edits, (cant find any revs) he's even outed his own name. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:37, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You can remove this comment and rev del this if you want, but here's some revisions that may give you an idea of how his name is public. [35] [36]. While GRP hasn't been vandalising Wikivoyage for a month now, I doubt this will be the case when the protection expires tomorrow. But can you remove the protection a day earlier, I'm sort of sick and tired of trying to maintain two talk pages, if only 82 creates an account. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:45, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
BJW would probably be OK. A user name is not confidential information, unless you have outed yourself with one name (such as many do for their photos on Commons) while keeping your identity secret with another. I do think Antandrus says too much. Telling ones name to you is not making the information public. If I tell you mine, it's confidential information, and although he might not have a plan on what to say and not to say, we should treat any personal details that weren't common knowledge from before as privileged. This includes things that can be dug up from public logs and page histories.
I am sorry that you get all this harassment, but we need to be professional in not bawling out or unveiling privileged information.
LPfi (talk) 07:33, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for the info! I will archive this early in 2 days as this exact thread is a target for GRP. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 09:31, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Go ahead, as soon as you wish. –LPfi (talk) 09:34, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I might wait for 5, as if anyone else might come up with something. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 09:36, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
"I do think Antandrus says too much" -- you are right, and I know it too. We should probably change our overall approach and not use his name at all. Just quietly remove his sputter and point people to the LTA page when necessary. Antandrus (talk) 16:26, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
"This includes things that can be dug up from public logs and page histories." - no. Anything public is public and can be referenced and reused under the WMF ToS. I had to tell the same thing to User:ThunderingTyphoons! who complained about my linking that anon user with their actual account and called it "outing". Seems to be a project-specific thing. Overall, I do not believe that SHB2000 made a mistake. Leaderboard (talk) 17:22, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You may be right in terms of ToS and law, but that is only part of the picture.
I strongly believe in respecting people's privacy. Especially in this time, everything about anybody can be deduced from non-secret information, and I think collecting, sorting and publishing the information is not something to do. When I speak with my friends in the bus, or in the street, even in my yard, I know that people around can hear what I say, but I'd be disappointed if they told what they heard on Facebook next day, coupled to my identity, which they recognised or found out by an image search. I like the rule on the communication radio: anybody listening on the channel can hear what you say, but they may not tell anybody.
There are things that must be said, that fellow administrators (and perhaps other trusted fellows) must know to fight vandalism effectively, but about such things one should tell only what is useful for others to know, and they should understand that they got the information in confidence.
LPfi (talk) 20:09, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'll openly admit that I'm a person who prefers names, over usernames, but I myself do not like to reveal my name, even in emails. While some people openly reveal their name in their usernames (e.g. User:Ikan Kekek, User:Anirban Kolkata or User:KevRobbAU/SCO) while others reveal their first names on their userpages.
And to say, I do know User:ThunderingTyphoons!', User:LivelyRatification's and User:Ground Zero's full names, but I still use TT and GZ due to privacy.
I could've had my name outed, after an edit war with someone on enwp, after continual edit warring due to w:WP:NOR, but instead he chose to out me on instagram instead of wikipedia. And I do certainly agree with LPfi here with the radio rule.
And Leaderboard, and for outing 82's old ID, tbh, I also did not think it was outing as if you follow a set of certain pages, you could find the old username. I know it was not a mistake, but I believe this was done upon 82's request.
--SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 23:54, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I do not reveal my name to people I don't trust and don't want it broadcast. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:31, 30 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So is Ikan not your first name? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 05:33, 30 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
After reading your userpage, I see what Ikan Kekek means: "Ikan Kekek is the name of a Malaysian fish and a children's song" That makes sense. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 05:51, 30 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Barncompass indexation

Hiya, should it not be clear, this is a response to your pitch in the pub. I'm much in favour of the idea I'm hearing, but I feel like there's some vague spots in the pitch that allow people to misinterpret your intentions. The concept as I understand it largely comes down to making barncompasses somewhat like {{Rint}}, in which standard transit lines are made more easily accessible through a template, aside from the fact that this one would, of course, print barncompasses rather than tram and metro lines :)

Since I did a lot of work on RINT myself, and felt like a mock-up of the idea might help your cause, I've gone ahead and made a mock-up based off of what I think you're trying to achieve. I don't want to deviate the discussion in the pub, so hence why I'm notifying you directly. Right now, there's two templates, and that's all it would need:

  • BC. This would be a customisable version of {{Barncompass}}, making it modular and thus removing the need for a 1:1 ratio of templates and barncompasses where every type of barncompass has a template for itself. It allows for customisation of not only the text, but also allowing one to easily pick the image (|img=), scale it (|size=) and add a different title (|title=).
  • BCindex then uses that modular template to recreate existing barncompasses, and allow for indexation of future barncompasses. Ideally, it would replace {{Barncompass}} as it stands now. I can assure you that it wouldn't break any existing barncompasses using that template. For now, all that works is the silver, gold, sysop and default variations. When a barncompass isn't found, it defaults to display the entered parameter (or in other words, everything after {{Barncompass|) as plain text in a default barncompass, thus not breaking any of the existing barncompasses should this be moved into {{Barncompass}} itself.

As a very brief how-to: {{User:Wauteurz/BCindex|}} is the template you use. Follow this by the code, for example silver, and follow this with your text, separated by a pipe (|). You can omit the compass code (silver, in this example) and it will print a default barncompass with anything else specified after the template name printed as the accompanying text. Both of them print as follows:

{{User:Wauteurz/BCindex|silver|This is a silver barncompass!}}
Barncompass-Silver.png The Silver Barncompass
This is a silver barncompass!
{{User:Wauteurz/BCindex|This is a barncompass without a specified code.}}
Barncompass.png The Wikivoyage Barncompass
This is a barncompass without a specified code.

I'm not trying to steal the idea from you, should that not be obvious. Unless you honestly want me to, I won't work this out further to become a proper usable template set, since you asked whether it is something that you should do or not, and I don't intend to rob you of your projects - I have plenty of my own. If you go for it though, might I suggest you use ISO 3166-1, Alpha 3 codes for countries and regions as well as the names of countries for their indexation? In any case, let me know whether this is what you meant or how else I should interpret your pitch, and I can alter the mock-up accordingly if you want me to. I honestly think it's a great idea, and I'd like to see it succeed. If you need the help, just let me know. I'd be more than happy to help you with developing this idea :)
-- Wauteurz (talk) 14:00, 22 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you so much. I'd love a mate to work this alongside me. So if I put {{BC|type=AU|message=message xyz}}, that's the way to avoid confusion with the original Barncompass? I'm not that great with coding (apart from html), so any help will be greatly appreciated. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 00:09, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No worries! The templates I linked above are both still in my userspace, so you'll have to use User:Wauteurz/BCindex as the template name to call it correctly for the time being. I've added a few Barnstars of National Merit (BoNM) from Wikipedia as placeholders for barncompasses, and they can be accessed through either the ISO 3166-1 α3 code I linked above (i.e., the three-letter code assigned to that country), or the full name of the country, removing any spaces. The current options are:
  • Australia: aus or australia
  • New Zealand: nzl or newzealand
  • Papua New Guinea: png or papuanewguinea
  • Vanuatu: vut or vanuatu
And for clarity, BC is the bare barncompass, and does not know how to make any other barncompass than the default by itself. Using BC, the Australian BoNM would have to be called by specifying what it looks like: {{User:Wauteurz/BC|img=BoNM - Australia Hires.png|title=The Australian Barnstar|[your text here]}}. BCindex is the index of pre-configured barncompasses, and for that you can simply define {{User:Wauteurz/BCindex|aus|[your text here]}} instead. BCindex is the template that the compass-gifter would see. BC is the template the compass-maker would use to create new or custom barncompasses. In an ideal world, I would move BCindex into what is now {{Barncompass}} (it won't break existing barncompasses unless they're defined in a weird way), and BC would become something along the lines of {{Barncompass base}}, ideally with a redirect from {{BC}} so that the codes in BCindex can be kept a bit shorter. I've done this with RINT as well - RINT calls {{Routebox entry}}, which is abbreviated as {{RbE}} (and RINT itself is an abbreviation of {{Rail-interchange}}), but I digress.
Also note that the parameters used in BCindex do not have to be defined. In other words, you don't have to tell it what parameter you're trying to define (|type= and |message= in your example). It checks what parameter you're defining by its order. Therefore, the Barncompass's code has to be defined first, followed by the message. See this as the organisation you also use on your PC. You would generally put images in the folder for images, so you have to open that before you can view any images. Here you have to tell BCindex that you're wanting to access the Australian BoNM, and then tell it the text you want it to print within that. This could be expanded to include subregions, such as the US states. Those could be put on a 'folder' within the USA 'folder', so that California is accessed through {{User:Wauteurz/BCindex|usa|ca|[your text here]}}. This would then remove the need to use three-letter codes, and we could switch to the two-letter codes instead, which tend to be better known because they largely match the top level domains for these countries. I haven't made a real look-up page for it, but if you want to check the current codes, jump into the source code of BCindex and see for yourself. The template is somewhat annotated with <!-- NOTES -->.
I hope that answers your questions :)
-- Wauteurz (talk) 12:18, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:35, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And sorry for stealing your template, but I did do some experimenting with it. Might do a bit more to see how it turns out. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:12, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No problem whatsoever. Feel free. I don't know if you want me to, but I can add some extra options for customisation to the barncompass base template (User:Wauteurz/BC). Think of things like definable colours for the border and background. Also, the template you copied uses the switch-function. If you aren't familiar with it, you'll find some documentation and examples on MediaWiki and Wikipedia. I would suggest that you put some of the subregions of Australia that you added under Australia itself as a switch-function on the second parameter. I'll copy your additions into the version on my userspace with that structure, should you want it as reference. I'll leave the one in your own userspace for you to play around with. If there's anything that you can't manage to change or fix, then please shoot me a message! I'm happy to help out.
-- Wauteurz (talk) 13:45, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Reaction on your last edit. With 4x "-" you get a long line in the full width of the page. With many "_" you get a page that can have a horizontal scrolling bar. So, "----" makes:

--FredTC (talk) 09:49, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks Fred. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:31, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Your revert on my edit on Australia

By reverting my edit you restored the quite messy situation of having 3 different formats for times in just one article: 21:00, 4PM and 6pm. They are even all 3 in the same section of the article. In the heading of the talk page it says "please use the 12-hour clock", and on the same talk page it says "We have a general policy of using only one time format in an article". --FredTC (talk) 12:14, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Oh whoops, that was my mistake. The time format in Australia is quite an unusual one with older generations using 12 hr time while younger generations using 24. Hence why you see me preferring 24 over 12. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:16, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

17:08, 24 May 2021 (UTC)

My article status templates

Moved from the IP talk page after 14 days of discussion being stale

@SHB2000: Hi, I am changing my article status templates to try to show the article status boxes at the bottom on an article, and I realised that this messed up your userpage. The new template is located at User: status. Thanks, 18:34, 23 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks. On a little bit of a side note, I suggest adding a documentation. Since any user might want to add this, this might as well help. Could also help with other things as well SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:36, 24 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000: I tried to do that, but it made the documentation template appear underneath the article status templates when I tested it on my userpage. 15:40, 24 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@, sorry for the late response, but you're meant to include the <noinclude> code around the documentation.

Like this:


Cheers, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:10, 26 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000: Thank you! 14:22, 26 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No worries mate. Remember, you can always ask me if you need anything. Cheers, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:43, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000: I redirected User: to User:, and I realised that this left a blank gap in your userpage. {{User: status|6}} should produce Featured article candidate.svg Starnom, which is what was on your userpage before. Thanks, 12:31, 2 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for letting me know mate. I'll fix it right now. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:33, 2 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes Done SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:35, 2 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000: I have finished with User talk:SHB2000/nonsende and User talk:SHB2000/nonsende2. 14:53, 2 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Moved from the IP talk page after 14 days of discussion being stale

@SHB2000: When I type {{User:|city}}; it does this. Do you know why it is not centred like the actual template?

Cscr-featured.svg This city travel guide to SHB2000/Archive 2021 is a star article. It is a high-quality article complete with maps, photos, and great information. If you know of something that has changed, please plunge forward and help it grow!
Thanks, 16:43, 26 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@82, I'll take a look into it right now, at the time of this comment. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:41, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Had a look at it, I'm not too sure why. @Wauteurz:, do you have any idea why 82's template is doing this? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:42, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@SHB2000, Took me a bit to find this one. This problem occurs because the image and the text share the same cell in the table that makes up the structure of this template. Because the first line of text prints at the same height as the image, the second line will force itself to fit below the image. I'd suggest making a left and right column. Left for the image, right for the text, and that should resolve the issue. It's easy to miss, but if you look at the template for the current star boxes, {{Stbox}}, you'll find the following code on lines 9 and 10:
|{{#ifeq: {{{status|}}} | star | [[Image:Cscr-featured.svg|100px]] | }}
|This {{#switch:{{{type|}}}
The pipes (|) used at the start of each line indicate that the two elements (the image on line 9 and the text, which starts at line 10) are in separate columns from each other. They have no further modifications through CSS attributes, so you should be fine with just splitting the elements across two columns. Other than that, the templates look more or less identical, aside from 82's version having a decentralised structure (which I should add is a bit annoying when trying to troubleshoot it).
-- Wauteurz (talk) 09:04, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Wauteurz: I have tried splitting it across two columns, however this now makes the star appear on top of the words. Do you have any ideas on how to fix this? 17:39, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@ I don't see this edit back in the template? If I look at the edits, there's the insertion of a new line for the text, but that's not how tables work. All this does is force the text onto a new line, whereas you need a separation on the horizontal axis. A new line only does something on the vertical axis. You'd have to add a column into /Starborder's code on line four, with that column only containing a parameter named "2". (|{{{2}}}. "1" would contain the image, "2" would contain the text, and this would require /Star to be edited accordingly (|city={{User:| «image» | «text» }}). In other words, the enters in /Star need to be replaced with a pipe, and that should have the entire thing resolved.
You might need a bit of fiddling with the HTML/CSS on /Starborder if the width of the columns needs tweaking, or if there are instances where no image is displayed, you'd want to hide the column in /Starborder under an #if-module, which would check for an "image" parameter and whether it is present or not. In that case, the "image" parameter replaces "1", and "2" becomes the new "1", and that should be everything done.
-- Wauteurz (talk) 20:33, 27 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Wauteurz: That works now. Thank you! 18:36, 28 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No worries! -- Wauteurz (talk) 20:19, 28 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This Month in Education: May 2021

This Month in Education

Volume 10 • Issue 5 • May 2021


In This Issue


Did you check Talk:Smögen before making this reversion? I would have left it alone. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:24, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Oops, didn't check it. Sorry. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 05:26, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also Ikan, feel free to revert me anytime if I've made a mistake. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 05:43, 29 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi. I always appreciate your hard work on this site, but you don't know how to recognize that guy's edits yet. I'd suggest, therefore, that for the time being, you ignore edits by people with usernames that could be him and leave the determination to others, unless you are sure the edits are useless. Also, it's totally useless to post any message to the talk page of any of that guy's innumerable socks, because he'll never read or pay attention to it. I post a user talk message only when I think it's him but I'm not completely sure (and even I and some other admins make mistakes at times).

All the best,

Ikan Kekek (talk) 12:14, 30 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

@Ikan Kekek: Thanks for your message. Yes, I do agree with you that I'm not fully able to recognise Brendo's edits yet, I am well aware his target pages: Usually Sydney districts, random towns along NSW and Queensland, Aboriginal culture, WWI and WWII, some ancient medieval culture and Star Wars pages. Usually those edits are just an added listing, poor quality. However, I was just extremely tired and exhausted, and possibly my 2100h self is just who I am not.
Also unrelated to this, but should I remove the cyclone warning in Kolkata. User:Anirban Kolkata has said it's over, but I do want to check with an experienced user, rather than removing it myself.
Take care,
SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:49, 31 May 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I would trust local knowledge on that kind of thing. Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:03, 1 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

17:06, 31 May 2021 (UTC)


assume good faith. how is this spam?

~ SHB2000

Hello, BeatriceH35 is just a spambot, a script that runs to add a massive number of spam links. Spambots usually have a particular pattern and should be (b)locked on sight, as well as their stuff should be deleted. See also their abuse log. I would like to ask you to kindly reconsider your revert. Best, —Hasley (talk) 02:39, 1 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Hastley, thanks for the clarification. Wasn't aware of the other types of spambot accounts, but usually on Wikivoyage, they are just self-promotion or a tour agency advertising tours on their userpage. I've rollbacked my edits, and sorry about the revert. Take care, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 03:28, 1 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It seems it would be handy to have a link to global contributions on the page you land on when you are patrolling new user pages with external links. Wouldn't that catch spambots? –LPfi (talk) 10:13, 1 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Not too sure. I've only started to use SWViewer today, so I'm not too sure on how this works. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:15, 1 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wow! 7500 edits!

Much appreciated. I had a period of reduced activity from February to May (unfortunately) and therefore for me you’re a relatively new contributor to WV. It’s great to see your enthusiasm for the project, so keep up the good work.

We like to use only four digits after the decimal point in coordinates (a minor technical point) just because it’s easier to use while still being accurate.

Thanks again! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 13:52, 3 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks. While I've just reached this milestone. The one mistake I wished I hadn't made was editing under an IP for 9 months on en.wikipedia. And yes, while I'm an admin on another project in a language that I barely know, I still prefer wikivoyage more, than the other WMF projects.
And to a coincidence, I just happened to get autopatrolled status on meta, (not a big thing though), but the timing did intrigue me.
Cheers, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:55, 3 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yeah, keep up the good work, your contributions are really helping out with the travel guide. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 22:10, 3 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Kainji National Park

Moved from the IP talk page after 14 days of discussion being stale @SHB2000 thanks for your edit on Kainji National Park. It was really helpful. But Was struggling to get the stub off the article.

No worries mate. You can always leave me a message here if you need help with anything. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:24, 4 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You are absolutely right here,

But as they say in Wikipedia, "don't bite the newbies". There is a group of new editors in Nigeria who don't know much about Wikivoyage, but they are helping to build articles that our existing pool of editors can't do much with. Let's be sure to encourage them. Ground Zero (talk) 15:30, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sorry there, that was my tired 23:50 self. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:33, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It happens. ;-) Ground Zero (talk) 22:23, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I agree with you guys, but I think we also ought to check that these types of edits aren’t copied from somewhere. I like the work these Nigerian contributors are doing but it needs supervision, and if you’re not familiar with copyright/copyleft (as most people aren’t), it’s easy to copy a paragraph or article from a WP or non-wiki source without attribution and without realizing such action is not allowed. The information about schools is an example of what I’d suspect as copyvio because it doesn’t make sense why someone would write this content on a travel guide. I’m not saying we should admonish these “newbies” but we should put our resources into helping them learn how to contribute best to this wiki. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 22:11, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I've been trying to coach them, with some success. It would help to have other experienced editors doing this too so that it doesn't seem like just me and one or two others nagging them. Ground Zero (talk) 22:23, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure, I’ll chip in when I can. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 23:32, 6 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I've just tagged two pages for deletion. Anything over 75%, is not, and is less than 15 days old is almost certainly a violation. Could either one of you, @Ground Zero, SelfieCity: delete those pages? Thanks, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:30, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I have raised the question of Murtala Muhammed International Airport on the user's talk page, and want to give him a couple of days to respond. Where is Kainji National Park copied from? There are parts that look like they are from Wikipedia, in which case I would just do the accreditation and remind the user to do so going forward. Is there text from another site? Ground Zero (talk) 12:38, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
KNP is copied from here SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:40, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yeah, i found the text on another site. I have notified the user. Let's wait a couple ofdays for a response. Ground Zero (talk) 12:43, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
3 is reasonable, isn't it? Considering that copyright is a legal issue here, I'm not all that comfortable waiting more than that. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:47, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
There's also the point that most of these airports clearly fall outside our criteria for which airports get their own article. All of them probably do, but the only one that would seem possible is Murtala Muhammed, since that's the airport for Lagos. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:43, 7 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Probably best to just leave a message on the talk pages of the editors who have created out of criteria. After all, even users who've been here for months can make mistakes about Airports too. I did make that mitsake when drafting an article for Darwin International Airport. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:26, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I did post to his user talk page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:41, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm well aware of that. But my point is that there's nothing much else we could do. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:43, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure there is. We can delete them as copyright violation and/or make them redirects. Ikan Kekek (talk) 09:11, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also, I'm not sure what to do with AmyCutie who keeps creating a uni page. Could you pp it permanently for temp editors and admins only? SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 09:13, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You will have seen by now that I blocked her for a day to try to get her attention. It's best not to assume I'm always available, though. The only reason I was available this much last night is that I slept really poorly. If you'd like something to be done. contacting individual admins may not be the most effective means. Ikan Kekek (talk) 14:24, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Noticed that. Yeah I only contacted you because you seemed to be the most active admin that hour. Anyway, this will be my final edit for today, as it's 0026 in Sydney here. Take care, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 14:26, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sleep well, and thanks for caring. Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:19, 8 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also, thank you for guiding these new editors. As far as I can tell, some of these users will possibly become long term users at Wikivoyage, and to say, most have had a rough start, but eventually have got the hang of Wikivoyage. And also, slightly off topic, a correction to my earlier comment "this will be my final edit for today, as it's 0026", actually, it's one of my first edits for the day. I obviously can't think properly ;). Anyway, thanks again! SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:50, 9 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I always consider the day to end when I go to sleep or the sun rises, whichever comes first. Ikan Kekek (talk) 13:50, 9 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Same here. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 00:13, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

20:03, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

Lime scooters

You reverted IP edits in Turku and Tampere, on Lime scooters, with no comment. I suppose the comment on their talk page was related to these. Was it because the IP added "(cheapest)". I'd have simply removed that comment – as there is no guarantee that is true after a year, and the prices are not posted publicly. Was there some other reason to revert the edits?

I haven't yet seen any Lime scooters since they were removed (because of the pandemic, I suppose, it might have happened earlier), but I suppose the IP editor knows they are back.

I don't see any reason to treat the IP editor as a tout. For all I know they could be a local or a traveller, who just has been using scooters over here.

LPfi (talk) 12:14, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It's unusual to see an IP user to add a link to these electric scooters, in two different articles, along with the word "cheapest", which very much looks like a tout to me. Let's say, if I were a traveller, and I hired a bike (for examples sake) somewhere. I would write about the entire place I've been, and not just about bike hiring service, in two different spots. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:24, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Vkem redid the edits as logged-in. I suspect it was him also the first time. He is Finnish and adds a lot of Get in and Get around information (sometimes too much for my taste, but that's a different issue).
I can imagine myself seeing a Lime scooter in the street, and checking whether they are back in other places also. I haven't done it for scooters, but indeed for things like ferries or coaches.
LPfi (talk) 19:02, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If it were Vkem but logged in in the first place, I wouldn't have reverted it in the first place. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 21:46, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also LPfi, if I had not said that these edits were me but logged out, you'd think it's not me or an imposter. [44] [45] [46] SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 22:31, 10 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This Month in GLAM: May 2021

This Month in GLAM logo 2018.png

Read this edition in fullSingle-page

To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

"By air"

Hi. That is not a standard section header. The standard is "By plane". Just FYI. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:52, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sorry about that, I didn't actually check the content when fixing the headers. I'll check next time. Thanks, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:01, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure thing. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:04, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Also, could you help Zend2020 with get in and get around listings. I've just sort of explained it, but I'm not sure if it looks particularly helpful. Thanks! SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:10, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It did --Zend2020 (talk) 05:00, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Default banners

I am not used to the default banners (read: haven't been paying attention), so did not realise that the banner was indeed the African one. I supposed that syntax just did not work, so replaced it with the filename listed at Wikivoyage:Banner Expedition#Usage. The page doesn't tell about the keywords (or automatically choosing the right banner), and neither does the template page. –LPfi (talk) 13:23, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Here's just a tip:

{{pagebanner|Africa}} would produce the default African one

Here's just a full list
  • Europe - none
  • North America - none
  • Middle East - Mena Asia
  • North Africa - Mena Asia
  • Asia - Mena Asia
  • Caribbean - Caribbean
  • Australia - Australia
  • and so on. I'm planning to make some documentation for the parameters, so hopefully this should help, since I noticed that there weren't none.
Cheers, SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:30, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I added the keywords to the template documentation after writing here – but I had to look at the template code to find them. –LPfi (talk) 15:36, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks! SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 22:16, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Adding Images + Wikipedia

I need help both on wikicommons and Wikipedia and again sir How do I request for grant if I have a project here in Nigeria. —The preceding comment was added by Favourdare123 (talkcontribs)

Hey @Favourdare123:, here's just how it works:

[[File:|thumb (optional)|left, right or center (pick one)|size px(replace the size with the number|Caption (replace this with the test you want]]

So in this case, if I wanted to add File:Sydney Harbour NP board.png, 500px and on the right side of the page, then I'd be using

[[File:Sydney Harbour NP board.png|thumb|right|500px|Sydney Harbour National Park entry board]]

and it'll turn out like this:
Sydney Harbour National Park entry board
To upload images, go to c:Special:UploadWizard and follow the steps from there, it's pretty guided, and if you want, you could upload certain images from Flickr (depends on copyright license).
To create articles on Wikipedia, you have to go to w:Wikipedia:Article_wizard and follow the steps there. I've only made three articles on Wikipedia, and they're all stubs. If you want, you could also go to the Simple Wikipedia, which is where I make my Wikipedia articles (with my best one being w:simple:Aircalin). You might also want to ask Ground Zero, since he's a sysop on Wikipedia.
Also, there's no need to call me sir, I'm a lot younger than most people on this site, and I'm not an admin either. Hope this helps. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 01:08, 13 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
These directions are for editing the wikitext. If you use the visual editor (where the article is shown mostly the same regardless of whether you are editing) you have "easy to use" icons for doing the same things. There may be some third option on mobile. But if you get to the wikitext you can copy any code from any article, and if it doesn't contain too "smart" templates, it should work.
The upload wizard on Commons may feel daunting, but it is mostly quite straight forward and you will get used to it. You could look at some similar images to see what categories and descriptions usually look like. Here on Wikivoyage, you mostly have to first click the image, and then the "view on Wikimedia Commons" or "description page there" links to get to the true description page. If you get to the image viewer, the link is called something like "more information".
If you still have problems, please tell exactly what you have been doing and what did not work.
LPfi (talk) 11:38, 13 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

20:26, 14 June 2021 (UTC)

Highland Cinema

Hi there - I see that you removed the listing I recently tried to add for Highland Cinema in Fort William, as being an attempt to advertise or promote a business or service. Fair comment - it's my first time editing a Wiki, so was not too aware of the requirements. Can you advise how I can make a second attempt at this with impartial, factual language, or are you able to edit my original text to make it acceptable? I feel we should definitely be listed as something to either see or do in the town, though not even sure which! As we have a café bar too, we could also be included under the eat and drink sections. Any guidance you can provide gratefully received.

Thanks, Hamish —The preceding comment was added by HighlandCinema (talkcontribs)

Hello and welcome. Did you read the links posted to your talk page? Read the welcome, business owners page and the don't tout guidelines, and then if you have more questions, feel free to ask them in a reply below. Ikan Kekek (talk) 19:10, 15 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for replying Ikan Kekek. Sorry for not responding Hamish, as it was 03:27 in my local timezone so I haven't had a chance. I don't have anything much to add onto that, apart from the advice Ikan has given you. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:45, 16 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Emptying user pages

I think we should not blank user pages even if the user is globally locked. Adding the template is reasonable, so people know what happened, but users who have contributed constructively should have right to present themselves also after having been locked (given their presentation isn't vandalism in itself).

Removing the presentation by a user may also legally infringe on their right to be attributed, based on moral rights and the "by" clause of the licence: their contributions are attributed to the user name, which is coupled to their real life or pseudonymous identity mostly through the user page. Especially if the user name is non-descriptive, it might be deemed like changing the attributions not longer to point to themselves.

LPfi (talk) 08:25, 17 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Sorry for a late response. I read this response yesterday while bludging a meeting (which had really nothing to do with me) but was too tired to respond. While I get what you're trying to say, locked users' userpages almost always have the template {{locked}} on it. While I haven't seen much people from meta adding it here, I've seen it a lot on commons. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:04, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sorry for the fingerslip rollback. Have good weekend. Ground Zero (talk) 12:16, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No worries, and no need to be sorry. I've made this mistake a lot (especially when I first got rollback - only on this wiki though), but once I disabled one touch click, I haven't made that mistake ever since. Enjoy your Friday. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:19, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
SHB, are you a patroller then on this wiki? We can make you one if not; no one will mind in your case. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 13:07, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, GZ made me a patroller and a temp editor in April. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:08, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Great! --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 13:10, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
:) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:11, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I have seen blanking of user pages elsewhere, but I have not seen any convincing arguments for doing so. If the page is blatant touting or the user has contributed nothing that wasn't reverted, then I think blanking is OK, but if we are to attribute the user, then we should attribute them by linking to a user page in the form they chose themselves (with possible templates or manual explanations). –LPfi (talk) 13:36, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Maybe it's just a commons thing. But check User:Naledi Mathatho or User:Nale Mathatho. They had userpages, and yet they have the {{locked}} template. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 13:40, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Those are unproblematic, as the accounts haven't contributed significantly. User:CatDog1234539 has lots of unreverted edits (I didn't check how much remains, but I suppose they haven't been edited away). –LPfi (talk) 15:18, 18 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Guide status

I've reverted Lagos back to usable status for now because Lagos#Eat had some improperly formatted listings without enough information, IMO. Wikivoyage:City article status states that a guide status article should "closely match the manual of style" and I can't see that the article is there yet. I've instead upgraded Ibadan to guide status. Even though it has less information, it is consistently formatted, uses coordinates in almost all listings and includes detail for all listings. Let me know if you disagree or noticed something I missed. Thanks. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 14:22, 19 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I was definitely too rewarding I see. I thought I might upgrade some of these to encourage some editors here to keep up the good work. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 23:25, 19 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure. I don’t mind upgrading a little early for these editors, but that one just didn’t have what was necessary for status in my opinion. Thanks for your help with these contributors, though, and hopefully soon Lagos will be a guide status article. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 00:48, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hopefully... and I think they will. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 03:51, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Tbh, hopefully Old Oyo National Park is almost there as well. Just needs a custom pagebanner... SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 04:00, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If there are pictures in Commons I could do that one. By the way as you mentioned traveling on rural routes have you ever thought about writing itineraries or travel topics to Australian roads? Could be very interesting, particularly in the Outback. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 10:22, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I've started to do some really outback ones like Strzelecki Track, National Route 83 and some really far outback towns such as Innamincka, Lyndhurst (South Australia), Menindee, Bedourie and Tibooburra. I'm still in the process of doing Stuart Highway and A32 (still need to create A32, but I've only been on 47% of the route.
And for OONP, I looked onto commons and flickr, sadly there were none. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:10, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Wow, sounds good. Thanks for writing this. All we need now is a Wittenoom article... --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 11:15, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If I only get to go to WA ;) Fun fact, Like most people who live on the east coast, I've never been to the west coast, but I've been to both the east and west coast of the US numerous times :). SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 11:19, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Wow, you’ve traveled quite internationally. Australia is definitely a place I’d like to visit in the long run. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 12:18, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]
:) SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 12:21, 20 June 2021 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Editting on WikiVoyage

SHB2000Thank you for kind words.I will surely do that.Thank you so much.--Zend2020 (talk) 04:28, 21 June 2021 (UTC)